Posted on 05/29/2020 6:20:47 AM PDT by bort
The attorney for the family of Floyd George . . . wants to do an independent autopsy.
(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...
Do u even understand what the full body weight of a knee to one of your
main blood arteries will do?
Does not matter what he did before that high pressure was applied to
one of his main blood arteries. At that point he was handcuffed. Under
control, and screaming he could not breath. Yet the pressure was not lifted.
Why didn’t the police just put him in the back of a police car?
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Yes, it does matter. Ask yourself a question: Why would three police officers be pinning a guy down who is in handcuffs?
a) The cops thought it would be a fun way to spend an afternoon.
b) The cops are sadists who enjoy pinning people down; or
c) The suspect was belligerent/violent/uncontrollable, appeared to be on PCP/drugs and was a danger to himself or others?
My educated guess is “C.” And perhaps that is why Crump and the media have not outed the video yet of what prompted the police to be on top of Mr. Floyd.
As to why the police didn’t put him in the back of the patrol car, they had already called an ambulance so they had to leave him outside the car.
The issue isn’t whether putting one’s knee to the neck of a suspect is great policing (it isn’t), but whether it ACTUALLY CAUSED THE DEATH in this case.
BTW, Mr. Floyd looked like a body builder. A guy like that who is high on PCP/alcohol is like handling a bull. You can sit on your couch and second guess. But if the police had got up and Mr. Floyd leapt off the ground and ran in front of a truck, or hurt someone, you’d be the first saying “Why didn’t the stupid police hold him down”?
Finally, if you can scream multiple times: “I can’t breathe”....you absolutely can breathe. He was incoherent and rambling not because he couldn’t breathe, but because he likely was on drugs. Perhaps that is why Crump is calling for an independent autopsy.
“It doesn’t matter if he was drunk, high, or stone cold sober.”
It does if the only other option would be to shoot him.
“It does if the only other option would be to shoot him.”
He was face down on the ground. Handcuffed. I saw no evidence of active resistance then. Did you?
And EMT on the scene told the cop to his face he was killing that man. He continued and three other cops did nothing to intervene. They rendered no assistance to their fellow officer.
So if he was resisting and posing a threat why did cops number 2, 3, and 4 not pile on? Why did they stand their with their thumbs up their butts watching?
No my friend, this is a bad kill by that cop. There’s simply no excuse for it.
None.
L
In the Michael Brown case they hired a retired NY medical examiner whose autopsy actually helped prove that Michael Brown charged at the police officer "like a raging bull", as one witness said, because the fatal shot entered from the top of his head and exited near the eye socket. Hard to do unless the shooter is standing on a ladder or Michael Brown has his head down in a charging position.
And the EMT on scene told the cop to his face he was killing that man. Yet he continued.
Have you ever even watched the video? Because it looks to me like you’re just making shit up.
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The “EMT” you are talking about wasn’t someone that was called to the scene. It was an off-duty, out of uniform individual who was part of a gathering crowd that was yelling at the officers. Your statement is misleading. BTW, had this off-duty EMT calmly approached the officer and ID’d herself properly, I’m confident that the police would have gladly allowed her to take a look at him. But when you are screaming like a fool....well.
OK, so let’s suppose that in addition to the video evidence, we learn that the 2 other police officers were grabbing Floyd by his testicles and squeezing as hard as they could. And one of them had their thumb up his blank. And all three were praying that he would die. But the autopsy comes back and shows that the knee to the neck, the testicle squeezing, praying and the thumb up the blank did not contribute to the death. Guess what: There was no MURDER!
The only side I’m taking is that of fairness and the law. I am open-minded, but want all the facts before I rush to burn down a city and call four police officers murderers.
Sounds Ok to me. Why wouldn’t the do this?
The City of Minneapolis should meet with the family and hand them a blank check. (Well, up to a limit) and roll over.
We had a patient die at our hospital one time. It was not intentional negligence, but a case where the patient should never have been admitted to our facility (their risk factor should have had them in a higher level acute care facility.)
I was in a meeting where the Administrators and Accountants were discussing the “defense” and how much money they should get for the death of a young mother and child.
About halfway through the meeting the President asked what the liability insurance would cover. He then added a dollar amount to that (in excess of the insurance), said it was our fault, and settled it.
Sometimes you need to simply admit defeat, insure it will not happen again, and settle up. It saves time, money, and pain for everyone involved.
And EMT on the scene told the cop to his face he was killing that man. He continued and three other cops did nothing to intervene. They rendered no assistance to their fellow officer.
So if he was resisting and posing a threat why did cops number 2, 3, and 4 not pile on? Why did they stand their with their thumbs up their butts watching?
No my friend, this is a bad kill by that cop.
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Of course you are assuming that the officer’s actions caused the death of Mr. Floyd. Two things can be true: 1) The officer used excessive and inappropriate force to pin Floyd down; and 2) Floyd died of a drug overdose or some other cause not related to #1. If #2 is the case, four police officers have been slandered and a city burned down for nothing. Perhaps that’s why Crump is calling for an “independent” autopsy. I’m withholding judgment until I see the autopsy, etc.
“I read that too, and it bothers me a lot. If someone passes me a fake $20 and I don’t notice, am I in legal trouble if I unknowingly spend it?”
Actually, technically you are. My guess is that you would cooperate with the Secret Service and tell them where you got it, make amends, and probably get off with a quick lesson on how to identify funny money. (Some of it is really good these days.)
You would not generally be arrested and thrown to the floor. You would get a summons that required a court visit.
I worked at a bank and we dealt with people trying to deposit fake bills all the time. 99% of the time the person had no idea they were passing forgeries.
“What prompted the cop to put his knee on the dead mans neck ceased to be relevant after about 15 seconds. “
Agreed. The cop is probably going to prison. All relevant facts will need to be considered to determine specific charges. Certainly a key one is whether this involved murder or manslaughter.
Is it possible the cop was just too stupid to know he was killing the man?
Do we even know for sure the knee hold is what killed this man? Was the cop putting his full weight on his neck?
It looked that way on the video but the jury will need expert opinions on all these factors rather than mob justice and chat room opinions.
“He was face down on the ground. Handcuffed. I saw no evidence of active resistance then. Did you?”
No, and the only reason for that might be the cop’s knee on Floyd’s neck. What little info I can find on the guy says he was 6 foot 6 inches. Bouncer. That can get out of hand in a hurry.
Follow
That's correct. Far too many people out there making statements of fact regarding determining guilt and what the cause of death was without knowing all the facts.
Very dangerous game to be playing. It can contribute to things like...well, riots and looting and arson.
Hands up, don't shoot!
I wouldn’t be surprised if the Autopsy shows that Floyd suffered a severed spinal cord due to compression on his neck.
That officer totally ignored any training he had.Otherwise he would have known Not to perform that act.
I talk all the time to one of the gals that works at the grocery store I shop at. She said fake $20’s is the new thing. Look like they just came off of the home printer and she gets them at least a couple of times a day. They just tell the person....it’s fake and set it to the side and keep it. They don’t even call the police anymore because it happens so often the police won’t come out. She said they’re so bad she can tell before they’re handed to her.
From what I have read, the clerks saw it was a fake immediately and tried to stop him leaving the store. Then they called the cops.
Obviously a knee to the neck is overreaction, especially when it stays there for a considerable amount of time. I do have a question and please don’t accuse me of not caring about Mr Floyd. The cop’s other knee was on the ground (as far as we know) so why do they keep saying that his full weight was on Mr Floyd’s neck? Mr Floyd was talking, so we know his airways were at least partly open. Would they be even artsy open if the cop’s full weight was on Mr Floyd’s neck? No. I am not condoning what the cop did. I am confused as to why the descriptions of police acts have to go to the extreme point. I guess the autopsy doesn’t show that that act was the cause of Mr Floyd’s demise. This country has been in serious trouble for a long time, because tensions have been exponentially inflamed to cause ‘race riots’.
The way Chauvin was kneeling on him with his hands in his pockets makes me think he has probably done this many times before. This time he did it to a guy who had some health issues, be it drug related or whatever, and he ended up dead. Once the guy was incapacitated he became responsible for his safety. He probably thought he didn’t have his full weight on him and the guy was crying wolf and who knows maybe he was in part. If you can talk you can breathe right. But it doesn’t matter because Chauvin had many opportunities to re-assess the situation and change tactics. He is screwed. I suggest saving your ammo, no pun intended, for the situations where LEO’s are being judged too harshly for split second decisions under pressure, not calmly and recklessly creating unnecessary problems for themselves and the community.
“Of course you are assuming that the officer’s actions caused the death of Mr. Floyd”
That’s a pretty safe assumption.
L
*artsy* = Partly
Small correction. The officer had on black latex gloves. They blended with the black trousers so that it appeared he had his hands in his pocket.
I can’t imagine any police officer engaged in an arrest that would be hanging out with his hands in his pockets. That’s not a preparedness posture for any officer to take.
"Do we even know for sure the knee hold is what killed this man?"
No, we don't know what killed him.
Was the cop putting his full weight on his neck? It looked that way on the video but the jury will need expert opinions on all these factors"
No, he was not putting his "full weight" on his neck. That's an emotional statement some are using. We can clearly see the cop isn't balancing his entire body (i.e. "full weight") on one knee. He would have more balance than a tightrope walker at a circus if he was doing that for ~8 minutes under those circumstances.
"rather than mob justice and chat room opinions."
Indeed. Imagine what's going to happen IF after all that's happened so far, the cop(s) is charged with murder due not to evidence but to mob pressure...and then in a court of law a crime of murder can not be proven? If all hell hasn't broken out yet (debatable), if likely would.
That's the danger of charging, trial and conviction by public opinion based on emotions and partial evidence.
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