Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: Kalamata
Kalamata: "Act dumb, much?"

Never, but your claim to be blind to literal mountains of evidence has to be the ultimate "dumb act".

Kalamata: "Okay, you pick one little pebble from that “mountain of evidence” you claim exists, and show us how it is scientific evidence for evolution.
We eagerly await."

I eagerly await your first ever visit to any natural history museum where you will steadfastly blind yourself to literal tons of evidence.

Kalamata: "It cannot be falsified, because it is not science."

Of course evolution theory could be falsified, in any of thousands of ways, should they ever be confirmed observations.
To pick just one example: dinosaur & elephant fossils, undisturbed in the same geological strata.
Consider, in the past 150+ years literally billions of fossils representing hundreds of thousands of extinct species have been found & classified, but not one confirmed as that type of anomaly.

But here is a partial listing of evolution predictions later confirmed.

Kalamata: "However, the fossil record reveals abrupt appearance followed by stasis, and disparity before diversity, both of which falsify any use of the fossil record to support evolutionism."

Now there is complete gibberish.
The fossil record, in fact, shows hundreds of thousands of species spread over hundreds of millions of years, and yet something like 99%+ of species aren't found because they left no recoverable fossils.
So all the "stasis" you allege is, first & foremost, the absence of fossils.

Second, geology shows that environmental conditions can sometimes remain unchanged for millions of years, during which life-forms also change little.
But when the environment changes -- hotter, colder, wetter, dryer, etc. -- then life too much change, or die.

The classic examples are dinosaurs whose fossils are found in strata dated over tens of millions of years, from beginning to end, then suddenly they disappeared.
Dinosaurs could not change enough to survive, but mammals & others did.

159 posted on 08/10/2019 7:49:25 PM PDT by BroJoeK ((a little historical perspective...))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 150 | View Replies ]


To: BroJoeK

You’re doing yeoman’s work! I’ve had my fill of olive man but I’m enjoying watching you spar with him.


164 posted on 08/11/2019 9:28:13 AM PDT by bwest
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 159 | View Replies ]

To: BroJoeK

>>Never, but your claim to be blind to literal mountains of evidence has to be the ultimate “dumb act”.

A pebble of evidence from that mountain of evidence will do. Can you not spare us a single pebble?

********************
>>I eagerly await your first ever visit to any natural history museum where you will steadfastly blind yourself to literal tons of evidence.

I have been to museums of natural history, and there is no evidence for evolution in any of them. You foolishly tried to pass off “Whale Evolution” as evidence, which proves you are clueless.

********************
>>Of course evolution theory could be falsified, in any of thousands of ways, should they ever be confirmed observations.

Gibberish. Evolution has never been observed, in any way. Devolution has, but not evolution.

********************
>>To pick just one example: dinosaur & elephant fossils, undisturbed in the same geological strata. Consider, in the past 150+ years literally billions of fossils representing hundreds of thousands of extinct species have been found & classified, but not one confirmed as that type of anomaly.

That proves nothing except there is plenty of evidence of hydrologic sorting and possible liquefaction. The fossil record shows evidence of a catastrophic, world-wide flood, with increasing terrestriality in the fossil record, from sea to land. The evidence of marine fossils in the highest layers, world-wide, is enough to cause any real scientist to pause, if not to reject uniformitarianism and Darwinism.

********************
>>But here is a partial listing of evolution predictions later confirmed.

Okay, you pick any item from that list and explain how it provides evidence for common descent. Any item.

BTW, is it true that Charlie was a big fan of William Paley?

********************
[Kalamata] “However, the fossil record reveals abrupt appearance followed by stasis, and disparity before diversity, both of which falsify any use of the fossil record to support evolutionism.”

>>Now there is complete gibberish.

Those are facts. I realize that Gould said some pretty foolish things, but those two paleontological evidences are well documented by him, and by others:


“Several of my colleagues (Jaanusson, 1981; Runnegar, 1987) have suggested that we eliminate the confusion about diversity by restricting this vernacular term to the first sense-number of species. The second sense-difference in body plans-should then be called disparity. Using this terminology, we may acknowledge a central and surprising fact of life’s history-marked decrease in disparity followed by an outstanding increase in diversity within the few surviving designs. . . Measured as number of species, Burgess [Shale] diversity is not high. This fact embodies a central paradox of early life: How could so much disparity in body plans evolve in the apparent absence of substantial diversity in number of species? of vertebrates? or of life on land? or simply of multicellular persistence for 600 million difficult years? “ [The Meanings of Diversity and Disparity, in Gould, Stephen Jay, “Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of History.” 1989, Chap. I, pp.48-49]

“The sweep of anatomical variety reached a maximum right after the initial diversification of multicellular animals. The later history of life proceeded by elimination, not expansion. The current earth may hold more species than ever before, but most are iterations upon a few basic anatomical designs.” [Gould, Stephen Jay, “Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of History.” 1989, Chap I, p.46]

“Before Niles Eldredge and I proposed the theory of punctuated equilibrium in 1972, the stasis, or nonchange, of most fossil species during their lengthy geological lifespans was tacitly acknowledged by all paleontologists, but almost never studied explicitly because prevailing theory treated stasis as uninteresting nonevidence for nonevolution. Evolution was defined as gradual transformation in extended fossil sequences, and the overwhelming prevalence of stasis became an embarrassing feature of the fossil record, best left ignored as a manifestation of nothing (that is, nonevolution).” [Gould, Stephen Jay, “Cordelia’s Dilemma.” Stephen Jay Gould Archive]

“It is a feature of the known fossil record that most taxa appear abruptly. They are not, as a rule, led up to by a sequence of almost imperceptibly changing forerunners such as Darwin believed should be usual in evolution... This phenomenon becomes more universal and more intense as the hierarchy of categories is ascended. Gaps among known species are sporadic and often small. Gaps among known orders, classes, and phyla are systematic and almost always large. These peculiarities of the record pose one of the most important theoretical problems in the whole history of life: Is the sudden appearance of higher categories a phenomenon of evolution or of the record only, due to sampling bias and other inadequacies?” [”The History of Life”, by George Gaylor Simpson, in, in, Sol Tax, “Evolution after Darwin Vol I - The Evolution of Life.” 1960, p.149]


*****************
>>The fossil record, in fact, shows hundreds of thousands of species spread over hundreds of millions of years, and yet something like 99%+ of species aren’t found because they left no recoverable fossils. So all the “stasis” you allege is, first & foremost, the absence of fossils.

Are you claiming the absence of evidence IS evidence? Now I have heard everything! LOL! This is Gould, again:


“[Gould] The extreme rarity of transitional forms in the fossil record persists as the trade secret of paleontology.The evolutionary trees that adorn our textbooks have data only at the tips and nodes of their branches; the rest is inference, however reasonable, not the evidence of fossils. Yet Darwin was so wedded to gradualism that he wagered his entire theory on a denial of this literal record:

“[Darwin] The geological record is extremely imperfect and this fact will to a large extent explain why we do not find interminable varieties, connecting together all the extinct and existing forms of life by the finest graduated steps. He who rejects these views on the nature of the geological record, will rightly reject my whole theory.”

“[Gould] Darwin’s argument still persists as the favored escape of most paleontologists from the embarrassment of a record that seems to show so little of evolution directly. In exposing its cultural and methodological roots, I wish in no way to impugn the potential validity of gradualism (for all general views have similar roots). I wish only to point out that it was never “seen” in the rocks.”

[The Episodic Nature of Evolutionary Change (Reprinted from Natural History 86:5, ‘Evolution’s Erratic Pace’, May 1977, p.14), in, Stephen Jay Gould, “The Panda’s Thumb.” W. W. Norton & Company, 1980, Chap.17, p.181]


Did you catch that last statement by Gould: “it was never ‘seen’ in the rocks”? LOL!

How about the last statement by Darwin: “He who rejects these views on the nature of the geological record, will rightly reject my whole theory.”

Thank you, Charlie. I rightely reject your entire theory.

*****************
>>Second, geology shows that environmental conditions can sometimes remain unchanged for millions of years, during which life-forms also change little. But when the environment changes — hotter, colder, wetter, dryer, etc. — then life too much change, or die.

The notion that the earth has been around millions of years is an imaginary construct with no supporting evidence.

*****************
>>The classic examples are dinosaurs whose fossils are found in strata dated over tens of millions of years, from beginning to end, then suddenly they disappeared.

There is no evidence for your conclusion, or that the strata is millions of years old. Besides, many animal groups have been found with dinosaur bones, including crustaceans, insects, invertebrates, and vertebrates, including mammals and birds:


“In order to test evolution, Dr. [Carl] Werner visited 60 natural history museums and ten dinosaur dig sites in seven different countries. When he asked paleontologists if they had any personal knowledge of modern birds found with dinosaurs, he was in for quite a surprise.

“I interviewed a scientist at the Museum of Paleontology at Berkeley who discussed a parrot fossil they had found in Cretaceous layers (‘dinosaur rock’). But the parrot fossil was not on display in the museum.

“With each interview, more modern birds that had been found with dinosaurs were added to his list, including: parrots, penguins, owls, sandpipers, albatross, flamingos, loons, ducks, cormorants and avocets. Carl assembled this list from interviews he did with various paleontologists, as well as from articles by evolutionist scientists and a textbook (the details of the sources can be found in Living Fossils).”

[Don Batten, “Modern birds found with dinosaurs.” Creation Ministries International, 2012]


The strata shows evidence of rapid deposition of all layers, as would be expected by hydrodynamic sorting and liquifaction. That explains the virtually flat sedimentary layers, including coal, with little or no erosion and bioturbation in and between layers.

*****************
>>Dinosaurs could not change enough to survive, but mammals & others did.

You made that up. That is called a “just-so” story. Absent story-telling like that, evolutionism would collapse like cheap construction in an earthquake.

Dan


174 posted on 08/11/2019 2:54:01 PM PDT by Kalamata (BIBLE RESEARCH TOOLS: http://bibleresearchtools.com/)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 159 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson