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To: Mrs. Don-o; ealgeone; Mark17
The difference, as I understand it, is that an evangelical of the "Once Saved, Always Saved" variety, would say that once you're saved, you're good to go, no matter what you thoughts, words and deeds subsequently may be. You can stop believing, stop praying, and stop walking in the way of the Lord and still be saved: Blessed Assurance.

Which shows several things.

First off it's a complete misunderstanding of the new birth and the changed heart and mind that accompany it.

So technically, while true that nothing you can do or not do can cost you your salvation, the believer would ask, *Why would I want to*?

And stop believing? How is that going to happen when God has given you His Spirit, the One who works in us to will and do to do according to His good pleasure?

Catholics as a whole do not comprehend what a new nature does in a person. They seem to think without motivation the believer will not press on in their Christian faith and growth.

IOW, they can't be trusted to do it on their own out of love and gratitude, so Roman Catholicism throws the burden of maintaining the person's salvation on them with threats of hellfire and brimstone for failure to do so.

It's salvation and sanctification under coercion with threats of eternal punishment and the fear of it being the motivating factors for compliance.

All of which goes to show that Catholicism misrepresents God's mercy, grace, and forgiveness.

They teach that God's mercy must be begged for and groveled for, that His grace must be earned aka *merited*, and that forgiveness is conditional and must be paid for even when we are told time and again that salvation is a FREE GIFT.

We don't have to merit grace or forgiveness because while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. He didn't demand we clean up our act first and become good enough to *merit* grace and forgiveness.

562 posted on 07/30/2019 12:30:27 PM PDT by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith..)
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To: metmom

St. Paul would disagree. See Romans 7.

Here’s a question. Were Ananias and Sapphira believers?


563 posted on 07/30/2019 12:33:13 PM PDT by grey_whiskers (The opinions are solely those of the author and are subject to change with out notice.)
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To: metmom
In all due courtesy, I asked you what YOU believe.

"In the interests of accuracy, is that what you believe? That once saved, you cannot lose your salvation? (Because if that is not your belief, then please explain what a person would have to do or fail to do, to lose their salvation.)"

This ("what YOU believe") is a subject in which I guess you would be an expert.

I don't know why you continue to make generalizations about what CATHOLICS believe, a subject which you have amply demonstrated that you cannot address competently.

"Catholics as a whole do not comprehend..."

"IOW, they [Catholics] can't be trusted to do it on their own..."

"Roman Catholicism throws the burden of maintaining the person's salvation on them ..."

"It [Catholicism] is salvation and sanctification under coercion ..."

" Catholicism misrepresents God's mercy, grace, and forgiveness...."

"They [Catholics] teach that God's mercy must be begged for and groveled for ..."

"[Cathholics supposedly believe] "we must clean up our act first and become good enough to *merit* grace and forgiveness.(etc etc)..."

Nonsense.

I asked for what you believe, and you gave me five paragraphs of your opinion of what Catholics believe, so distorted it would be Babylon-Bee-worthy, except that I don't think you intended it as self-parody.

If I had a nickel for every time I asked FReepers to tell me what THEY believe, and not bizarrely expand upon their view of what *I* believe, --- metmom, I could have a freezer full of Fudge Ripple Ice Cream and a couple reams of printer paper.

Whee! A dream come true!


From your exposition of your own belief, you seem to be saying that as a believer you could not sin, and could not even want to sin. "Why would I want to?"

I see no evidence that that is true. NT writers double down on the possibility of sin's recurrence.

1 Timothy 1:19
"Hold(ing) on to faith and a good conscience, which some have rejected and so have suffered shipwreck with regard to the faith."

If this rejection of faith were not possible, the Apostles' frequent exhortations and warnings TO BELIEVERS against sin would be unneeded and ridiculous. "Sin? Why would I want to?"

I'm NO expert of Evangelical apostasy, I am NOT and do not want to be involved in their business--- so I abstain from commenting on all that. But riddle me this: Why would Josh Harris or Franky Schaeffer or any of the avalanche of other Evangelical apostates "want to" turn apostate?

At least I know that some can "reject" good conscience and suffer "shipwreck" of the Faith. I know sin happens. I know, too, that the Church, the House of God, like everyone, will face the Judge.

581 posted on 07/30/2019 2:56:23 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God." - 1 Peter 4:17)
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