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To: fso301
“YEah but my understanding is those pushing for separatism are the hard left.”

Not really. Franco was a totalitarian dictator who was favored by the fascist governments of Italy and Germany, but he was anti-communist. From my perspective, a dictator is a dictator, and fascist totalitarianism or communist totalitarianism are just different sides of the same evil. Because Catalonia was anti-Franco, they've been labelled as to the left, but that's a misnomer in my opinion.

7 posted on 10/01/2017 2:25:12 PM PDT by neverevergiveup
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To: neverevergiveup
Not really. Franco was a totalitarian dictator who was favored by the fascist governments of Italy and Germany, but he was anti-communist. From my perspective, a dictator is a dictator, and fascist totalitarianism or communist totalitarianism are just different sides of the same evil. Because Catalonia was anti-Franco, they've been labelled as to the left, but that's a misnomer in my opinion.

No, it's a genuinely Marxist independence movement. It's in all of their propaganda, which has pictures of Muslims and other third world individuals with captions like "We are ALL Catalonians!" They hate Spain, they hate their own national identity (they are, in fact, just Spanish people), and they want to separate from Spain to establish their own Marxist government.

As for Franco. Anyone who kills Commies and keeps a nation from falling behind the Soviet Iron Curtain couldn't be THAT bad. The Communists in Spain were even digging up the skeletons of nuns and priests in their full-scale war against the population of Spain. They were murdering and raping and thieving. Franco saved Spain and protected them from the mass murder of the communist revolutionaries. He saved Spanish culture, their economy, and churches from the doom of absolute eradication.

19 posted on 10/01/2017 2:41:20 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: neverevergiveup; fso301

“Because Catalonia was anti-Franco, they’ve been labelled as to the left, but that’s a misnomer in my opinion.”

All the separatists in Spain are hard Left.

That’s why so many of their leaders are communists, socialists and green party members. Example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raül_Romeva

Here are the names of the Catalan parties that support separatism and the words they use to describe themselves:

Republican Left of Catalonia (Left-wing nationalist, Democratic socialist party)
Catalan European Democratic Party (Liberalism)
Popular Unity Candidacy (socialist, anti-capitalist party)
Catalan Solidarity for Independence (seems more interested in independence than any other political world view)
Catalan Solidarity for Independence (historically opposed to revolutionary communism but heavily involved with terrorism and assassinations in the 1920s and 30s)
Poble Lliure (left wing; and their logo is a riff on the Catalan flag made into a fist; clearly communist inspired)
Reagrupament Independentista (formed within the Republican Left of Catalonia (ERC) by members who opposed the party’s alliance with two other leftist parties, the Socialists’ Party of Catalonia (PSC) and the Iniciativa per Catalunya Verds (ICV))
Young Republican Left of Catalonia (pretty damn obvious from the name)
Arran (an organization rather than a party; socialist and femninist)

The simple fact is that the Leftists DOMINATE the Catalan call for independence and have for a century. By the way, the Catalan parties that oppose independence are also overwhelmingly LEFT WING.


38 posted on 10/01/2017 4:02:58 PM PDT by vladimir998 (Apparently I'm still living in your head rent free. At least now it isn't empty.)
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To: neverevergiveup

Franco was a leftist according to this Green Berret...

https://www.funker530.com/history-lesson-green-beret/


57 posted on 10/02/2017 5:27:02 AM PDT by lavaroise
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To: neverevergiveup

The war was about keeping communism out. Franco, a fascist, ruled with an iron fist and thru fear. He backed up that fear. But, that region is very left leaning. However, so is most of Spain these days.


69 posted on 10/02/2017 1:15:12 PM PDT by HollyB
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