Hey, great. You've been threatening me with non-reply activity repeatedly, yet keeping breaking your own word. Then, when you do, eventually you get around to showing us what's really in that little 'ol lyin' heart of yours. Dontcha' just love pressure tactics? (and insults) They're so purty. Seems you do love 'em, when it's not you that that is the target.
According to your own words, as best as I could decipher those, you would suborn perjury as a District Attorney! (if you could)
You've got that precisely backwards. It took a while, but it seems to me I was finally able to get you to notice what it takes to establish conspiracy. It is precisely there, at that point, that yourself (and the other troll, even more-so) work at confusing the issue.
Your own previous response to me disproves the underlined contention.
The defendants are being charged with various forms of criminal conspiracy. I'm not the one who is apparently conflating conditions under which; who could be identified as being in "a gang" ---to that immediately become grounds for leveling charges of conspiracy when a crime occurs involving a member, or members of these alleged-to-be 'gangs'. That's all Renya and company, and guys like you, and it's not *quite* the way the laws are written.
Circling back to that particular little mouthful of bass-akwards falsehood you'd puked out before, I see. You made that claim previously. It was responded to and dealt with. Apparently you failed to notice.
In detailing how you would go about things (establishing some proof of conspiracy) you'd mapped out how that kind of stuff can go. Leaning on defendants, having life sentences [undeservedly] hanging over them, in order to pressure them to turn against other defendants, even if those pressured had to lie in order to save their own asses. In this particular scenario, a big problem with all of that, is that there is abundant reason to doubt that all 178 who were identically indicted, are equally truly guilty. You know this. I know this this. It would be safe to assume Renya knows this. So-- hold that thought.
That knowledge also leads back to something you had asserted in comment #84;
Renya doubled down on the same misrepresentation of facts that he started with. The same ones that I know, and that you know (and Renya knows?) he WILL NOT be able to make stick, having like -- ZERO chances of making it stick to ALL. There's that word again. All.
Renya -- is -- a liar.
He doesn't believe he could --or even believe he had reasonable chance of proving all guilty as charged. That means, he lied. There is no escaping that. Turning focus upon what will most likely be ending results to excuse/justify the little white lies that were used (sworn to be "truth" even) as part of the means is attempt to justify those means by a desired end. The "means" have placed more than just a few persons in serious jeopardy, the same who it should be recognized, are most likely NOT guilty of engaging in conspiracy to commit crime, in Waco, that day, at the Twin Peaks restaurant.
It was obvious that Renya, from the very beginning of his own unorthodox, early-on "involving himself" in the process, was seeking to use processes of law in order for himself be able to coerce defendants through OVERCHARGING at least some of them, even a high percentage of "them" (which is deceitful practice, even if it has in lesser, MUCH smaller "crowd" numbers become somewhat of the norm for prosecuting DA's to do). Included in this instance, was the seeking for and obtaining that million dollar bail amounts be set over each of 177 defendants (plus more than a dozen more who were not eventually indicted -- had to be set free -- it would have been too embarrassing to continue asserting what was asserted in the cookie cutter arrest warrants).
Bail is not designed to be punitive, nor coercive other than to help ensure that a defendant not yet convicted of any crime (merely charged of crime) will show up for trial, and not have their freedom unduly taken from themselves in the meantime.
Among those were persons who were arrested, and had million dollar bail requirements set over them, and whom you would have attempted to coerce (possibly false) admission there was "drug dealing" intended upon, are persons such as Morgan English. You had mouthed threat, [under condition that if you were to be prosecutor, and were needing establish "conspiracy"] would include persons such as her be subjected to a DA's cynical pressure process. As you had said;
Key word; "knew". Other emphasis added for yet other key portions. Thank you. The way you put things is the mirror image of the argument I've been contending for. The key underlined and emphasized portions (due to lack of uniform, all-encompassing existence that would justify uniform, all-encompassing indictments) make the case, for me. There is not enough there, there. It falls woefully short, even by your own accounting(!). Can you fully hear yourself talk? Keep babbling, and keep coming back to Twin Peaks Edition 'Waco' threads. It's been fun...
Meanwhile, according to that little legal theory of yours --- ALL participants rode to Waco that day -- not to attend a COC & I meeting-- but in order to sell drugs (to each other?) after which, according to the other troll's theory -- they would have a gunfight in a public parking lot (having gone there to Waco to do that very thing).
You boys should get your little stories better coordinated.
You must have been intending to write murderers. From now on, no more snide remarks about my own less-than stellar writing skills. Mmm'kay?
Whoever it is that could be truly guilty of committing acts of murder --- let those individuals be fairly and duly tried. Not those persons, plus a significant number of others be swept up and identically charged in order to provide a DA leverage he can use to eventually win convictions of a much smaller number of defendants.
It is the word "ALL", and how that is being applied, that is what I have consistently objected to. As it stands now, defendants appear to be facing accusations (and may well in trial be facing those) which rely strongly upon pointing accusatory fingers of those not in the docket to help sway a jury towards convicting singular persons who are "in the docket" at their own singular trial(s). Renya is seeking to have it that way, obviously enough. The charges are rather vague, loose, and broadly sweeping, all the while relying upon impugning collective guilt in order to convict individuals for bearing singular personal guilt.
The process, as it is being applied in the Waco Twin Peaks cases, is proceeding from that direction and is thus ---backwards. A more rightful way would be to bring to trial (and convict) individuals for direct acts (of murder) for which afterwards, once the facts of that murder (or murders) were to have some tangible legal record of having been established, others could be tried as conspirators.
If closer details of what extent individuals had personal involvement (beyond mere presence) can be either avoided -- or else presented in trial murkily, potential for miscarriage of justice becomes very high. You should be able to recognize it. You've confessed, in part, to how those things can and do occur, yet added the acronym 'TS' (tough shit -- correct?). As you said;
In some rural counties. The link provided was about a case that had been tried in McClennan county. Whether or not "rural" (thus ignert' hicks, are you saying also?) we can't get closer to home, "Where crime so offends the populace, they want blood..."
When you said "tough shit", were you speaking beyond the "rural" populace's sentiments...including there your own?
No. no. and most certainly no. No illicit drugs for me either. Not even usage. Caffeine, nicotine, & acetaminophen could be (for the last thirty years or so) be found regularly in my system -- but nothing else (other than having undergone surgery and been given heavy painkillers -- morphine, maybe). Your I think I have finally figured it out was big phat swing -- and a miss! whoosh! Nothing there. Not even close. Watching you turn most 'way 'round in a circle after missing, was entertaining. haha. (you Big Dummy)
Nope. It wouldn't matter if I had, though. Like Trey Gowdy said the other day [paraphrased]
As for how defendants -- which in regards to the Waco Four you characterized as "marginally guilty"(?) in response to the link I had provided to an accounting or their ordeal --- even 'marginal'-- likely not apply.
Having been railroaded, though, most certainly does apply. You said to that;
Well, it's nice to see you say; it's "not nice".
The perseverance of LEO’s in McClennon County is not lost on the lawyers for both sides. It is one more reason for those marginally guilty parties to cut a deal early, testify against the Tier 1 defs and get out from under the steamroller.
Perseverance. Willingness to do what's "not nice" (or LEGAL either) included.
Since we know McClennan County prosecutors cannot be trusted to seek fair and just legal results (we know there is a culture of corruption there, or had been in the past) defendants wrongly charged should be allowed to be compelled to forfeit Fifth Amendment rights ---because that's the only way to save oneself from being convicted ---whenever a person finds themselves among those falsely charged. Got it.
The Waco Four got it too (but in a different "way") and in the end found out the little verbal promises provided (you tell us so-and-so did it, and we'll give you only probation) were a pack of lies. The liars? Friends of yours obviously? Cookie-cutter indictments -- meet online supporters of corrupt prosecutorial practices. The father of all liars has many children. Some of them like to hang around fancy church buildings and think themselves righteous. They are members and defenders of fancy church buildings. The blood of Jesus for me, but for thee -- not so much. TS?
PS, just to be sure of the issues in the matter, I called a retired Def lawyer in Waco, the older brother of one of my classmates. He is very aware of the issues, and says, at a minimum 4 to 12 of the perps will draw at least 20-Life, at least a dozen others 3-5, and many others settle for 180 in County.... and he is A DEFENSE lawyer!
I had about that much figured out, about a year ago. The guesstimate numbers were in the ballpark. The 180 day-ers (if there will be any of those which Renya will need to try to avoid that happening (since he had their motorcycles seized!) even as he has to let that happen would possibly allowed credit for time served?
Another here who was present on this thread (the person I told you I believed was an attorney) had come to approximately the same conclusion, also. About a year ago. Did your defense attorney friend agree that the legal process thus far has not been, at least in part (on part of DA's office) cynical manipulation of the process?
I was raised in Texas. My maternal grandmother's ancestors had to fight off Comanches (literally). On my mothers side, the Texas lineage goes back to the 1870's, or possibly earlier (the records become thin). You ain't tellin' me anything I don't already know. (The saying Don’t mess with Texas was initially about littering, and was often placed nearby signage that included listing of dollar amount range of fines for littering)
PS, No further replies to your BS.... It’s like teaching a pig to dance....
Generally speaking, you've lost again, and lost mightily, in yet another exchange with little 'ol me. Multiple PS (postscripts mid-letter, to boot!) haven't preserved your arguments. Instead, most every word you have said has been successfully used against your own arguments. How you like them apples? So much for the high opinion you have of your own learnin', and gifts of discernment too, when those are set to searching out this little black duck.
You are right. They will all be set free. They will all receive a hero’s welcome at the Bandito clubhouse in, where the Cossacks will detonate a 200 pound bomb they planted last week!
I really think you probably do not know how much deep doo-doo these defs are all in, and all your jailhouse lawyer BS is doing is moving this case up the ladder of interest to the DA and his statewide support officials. I say this as a matter of probably undeserved kindness; I’m worry that some of these scum, drug dealing, murdering defendants may actually believe the original article and all the jailhouse lawyer BS you and others have posted since. Every def, even these scum, deserve a good defense, and anyone relying on your BS isn’t going to get one.
Please take this to the bank: Many of these defs are going to prison for extended times. If they believe any of this legal mumbo-jumbo BS you post, rather than getting excellent legal advice from an experienced CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY who knows the local procedures in that area, they are locking themselves into prison for many, many moons.
9 people were killed and 18 others were wounded by groups well-known to be looking for trouble and being major drug manufacturers and distributors. The law will have its well-deserved piece of flesh. The bottom line is you and others can post all the jailhouse lawyer BS you want, but the perps are going down.... as they should.
PS, not that I, an aging gentle soul and learned legal scholar would ever advocate violence, but this is what many think should happen to your biker scum friends.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTzie3yKh40