Posted on 01/03/2017 1:56:38 PM PST by SeekAndFind
Ah, socialism. Is there ever a time you fail to amuse us?
In Finland we are seeing the launch of an idea which has been popular among liberals for quite some time but hasn’t really caught on anywhere. The government there has launched a pilot program where a select group of unemployed people will be given an assured basic income starting this month with no strings attached, no requirement to work (or do anything else for that matter) and no end to the program even if they go back to work. What could possibly go wrong? (Associated Press)
Finland has become the first country in Europe to pay its unemployed citizens a basic monthly income, amounting to 560 euros ($587), in a unique social experiment which is hoped to cut government red tape, reduce poverty and boost employment.
Olli Kangas from the Finnish government agency KELA, which is responsible for the country’s social benefits, said Monday that the two-year trial with the 2,000 randomly picked citizens who receive unemployment benefits kicked off Jan. 1.
Those chosen will receive 560 euros every month, with no reporting requirements on how they spend it. The amount will be deducted from any benefits they already receive.
A few things to note here include the fact that this is a very small pool of recipients (2,000 people) and there’s no indication as to how they were selected to participate. Also, the amount of “income” is pretty low. Less than 600 bucks a month in U.S. dollars isn’t exactly living high on the hog, but I suppose with their other, generous social welfare programs it might be enough to get by on, if not putting one in the lap of luxury. Also, they already have so many other goodies in the socialist basket that it might not have that large of an impact. The article goes on to note that the unemployed currently don’t even have to accept a job when one is offered if it’s for a lower rate of pay or is only short term and the refusal doesn’t affect their ability to collect benefits.
So will this work? You may recall that a similar measure was proposed in Switzerland last summer, but it was ultimately rejected by the voters. It seems that the laboratory test mouse for this case will be Finland, and it may wind up proving a useful social experiment for the rest of the world, including the United States, where some liberals have been pushing for a similar program.
The real question to be answered is the viability of the capitalist theory which states that you always need more people pulling the cart than riding in it. Will an assured income cause people to simply stop looking for work and live a modest life on the public dole or will some combination of desire for more wealth and a feeling of responsibility to the rest of society prompt them to earnestly seek out work? We’ve seen examples in the United States welfare system which would seem to indicate that at least some portion of the population will be willing to make do with less and avoid a nine to five job, perhaps indefinitely. That system only works as long as there are enough productive workers to keep funding the programs.
Personally, I’ve been waiting to see something like this tried so we can get some hard data, but I’m unsure if this is a good test case. Finland is such a small country and its people are already so steeped in a socialist mindset going back many generations that their results might differ from ours. Still, it’s worth keeping an eye on. Frankly, I think a plan like this would blow up almost immediately if you tried it in the United States, but if it remains limited in scope it might actually work for Finland.
What could go wrong, and what unintended, but foreseeable consequence will it bring forth?
Y Combinator Wants to Test a Revolutionary Economic Idea (Guaranteed basic income)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/3435894/posts
‘Cut Government red tape, reduce poverty and boost employment’
REALLY? How will giving people money, guaranteeing they won’t bother to try to find work boost employment???
Perversely, “guaranteed basic income” could be a path for Trump to amputate most of the “entitlements” part of the federal government. A big factor in the continuation of gov’t welfare expenditures is the massive self-sustaining bureaucratic infrastructure; by advocating the replacement of that hydra with a simple automatic direct-deposit system whereby everyone gets a flat poverty-line payment, the tremendous cost of running the system is saved.
(Don’t get me wrong. I think GBI is a staggeringly stupid idea. It’s just better, under the circumstances, than what we have now.)
Free money to freeloaders but don’t speed in Finland.
$100k for speeding
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/03/finland-home-of-the-103000-speeding-ticket/387484/
Clearly I can’t afford to live in Finland.
This differs from the Swiss model, in that the Swiss were considering giving this Living Wage to everyone, regardless of how much money you did or did not make.
This may be a bit more sustainable for a while, till a higher percentage of the population becomes unemployed and remains that way for generations at a time. The Invading Syrians and North Africans could soak all available up financing in no time.
Give them 2.5 years to exponentially grow into a stagnant mass of people on the dole.
Been following that on HN. The problem with that experiment is the money supplied is contributed _entirely_ voluntarily. You want to hand over money, no strings attached, to people claiming need? go right ahead. Communism crashes-and-burns when the productive have the fruits of their labors confiscated at [implied] gunpoint.
So, this taking the place of welfare reduces disincentives for employment.
Milton Friedman championed a similar idea.
Supposedly, you also get rid of a lot of bureaucracy in the process.
BUMS
“Those chosen will receive 560 euros every month, with no reporting requirements on how they spend it. The amount will be deducted from any benefits they already receive.”
Sounds like net zero to me.
Socialism only works (if at all) in a small, homogeneous society like Finland, with a shared culture & work ethic — and very tight immigration laws, like Denmark.
When I pointed this out to my ultra-liberal stepmother, she called me an elitist.
“So what about the Danes?” I retorted. “Why aren’t THEY elitist?”
I doubt something like this might work here, or as well.
(Don’t get me wrong. I think GBI is a staggeringly stupid idea. It’s just better, under the circumstances, than what we have now.)
Tell Obozo to be the pied piper and ferry his welfare crowd to Finland - they are gonna’ love you!
And just WHERE is all of this money going to come from ? Also, who will work, when they don’t have to; “refugees” who have no desire at all to work and NO skill sets? LOL
Someone already asked but I will ask again.
If they deduct this from benefits the person is already receiving how is this a new entitlement?
Perhaps they deduct it from something that was not money paid directly to them?
But would not they have to use that money to cover whatever benefit the gov’t deducted this 560 euros fro
I don’t think the Swiss or the Finns really think this is going to happen anytime soon. Therefore, they have not worked out all the logistics. Just like certain other causes, i.e.,The Global Warming “Crisis”, those in favor of it want to set the stage for a big, informal discussion that may proceed placing it on local ballots.
If this did come to fruition, the government would be under pressure by the Do-Gooders to pay without making any deductions in any other benefits already in effect. They would play on emotions; “Do you really want to reduce the available benefits of these desperate, loving, unemployed, illiterate, illegal, formerly incarcerated families? Oh, you almost sound like a Racist!!”
Inflation.
Idiots all.
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