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To: Safrguns

I agree that the courts will not take jurisdiction.

But you are making an error of logic.

Let me provide an analogy: A Sig Sauer SIG522 is a rifle. TRUE
A rifle is a Sig Sauer SIG522. FALSE

A person born of two US Citizen parents is a natural born citizen. TRUE
A natural born citizen is born of two US citizen parents. FALSE

While I have called the second two statements about FALSE, it would be more accurate to say that they are only true in a single instance, in that the object is an example of the general, and not the other way round.

The fact that both McCain’s parents were US citizens is great, and no one should dispute that McCain is a natural born citizen. But that does not mean that Cruz is not merely because only one of his parents was a US citizen at the time of his birth. The fact is that one parent is sufficient, both according the the US code, and the understandings common at the time of the Framing, except for the patriarchal aspects, which were and are not determinative, only social mores of the time. The fact is that citizenship moves by descent, and our laws say so.


72 posted on 03/11/2016 7:07:12 AM PST by John Valentine (Deep in the Heart of Texas)
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To: John Valentine

Then the senate had no need to test the citizenship of both McCain’s parents... which they did.

You really think that if either of McCain’s parents turned out to be NOT citizens that the democrats in the senate would have given McCain a pass???

I’m not asking if they should have or shouldn’t have...

I’m asking if they WOULD HAVE.

I think you know the answer to that one.


76 posted on 03/11/2016 7:55:10 AM PST by Safrguns
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To: John Valentine

“I agree that the courts will not take jurisdiction.”

The voters are the triers of the fact, and they are trying the case right now in these elections. Ted Cruz is losing a significant number of votes and voters due to his ineligibility and illicit political campaign. Nominating such an illegal candidate will result in handing a victory in the General Election to just about any candidate the DNC chooses to send forth.

“But you are making an error of logic.”

Wrong, the error in logic is yours, and you keep repeating their error in defiance of the written laws and case law.

“Let me provide an analogy: A Sig Sauer SIG522 is a rifle. TRUE
A rifle is a Sig Sauer SIG522. FALSE”

“A person born of two US Citizen parents is a natural born citizen. TRUE”

Wrong! The correct answer to that question is FALSE. No child born abroad with two U.S. Citizen parents is or ever can be a natural born citizen, except when born under the protection of diplomatic immunity. United State v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649, 18 S.Ct. 456, 42 L.Ed. “A person born out of the jurisdiction of the United States can only become a citizen by being naturalized....” Furthermore, in most decades of early U.S. history, a child born abroad with two U.S. Citizen parents acquired no U.S. citizenship of any form at birth, not natural born citizenship, and not automatic naturalized U.S. citizenship.

“A natural born citizen is born of two US citizen parents. FALSE”

Wrong again, because every natural born citizen of the United States is born with two U.S. Citizen parents.

“While I have called the second two statements about FALSE, it would be more accurate to say that they are only true in a single instance, in that the object is an example of the general, and not the other way round.

FALSE conclusion due to the erroneous assumptions and use of false logic.

“The fact that both McCain’s parents were US citizens is great, and no one should dispute that McCain is a natural born citizen.”

FALSE statement, due to the fact John McCain was born abroad in the jurisdiction of the foreign nation of Panama with two U.S. Citizen parents; and no child born abroad with or without U.S. Citizen parents can acquire any form of U.S. citizenship at birth by any means other than naturalization, except under diplomatic immunity; i.e. United State v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649, 18 S.Ct. 456, 42 L.Ed. “A person born out of the jurisdiction of the United States can only become a citizen by being naturalized....”

“But that does not mean that Cruz is not merely because only one of his parents was a US citizen at the time of his birth.”

The only means by which Ted Cruz could acquire any form of U.S. citizenship is by naturalization; United State v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649, 18 S.Ct. 456, 42 L.Ed. “A person born out of the jurisdiction of the United States can only become a citizen by being naturalized....”

“The fact is that one parent is sufficient, both according the the US code, and the understandings common at the time of the Framing, except for the patriarchal aspects, which were and are not determinative, only social mores of the time.”

Acquisition of U.S. citizenship by descent from the mother is only possible for Ted Cruz by the authority of the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Act of 1952, which is a law conferring upon Ted Cruz a form of naturalized U.S. citizenship. At no time in U.S., British, or English history would Ted Cruz have ever been a natural born citizen.

“The fact is that citizenship moves by descent, and our laws say so.”

Wrong, because that is a half truth used to perpetrate a lie and a fraud. Citizenship conferred by the authority of artificial statutory law is determined by a number of different means; whereas natural born citizenship is conferred by the natural fact of birth within the jurisdiction of the two citizen parents’ sovereign.


80 posted on 03/11/2016 12:07:17 PM PST by WhiskeyX
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