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To: ManHunter

Don’t tell me all that stuff. Go find someone out there who hasn’t made up their mind already. I don’t want to hear about this sacrosanct ‘conservative’ altar anymore. We’ve been screwed with that mantra left and right by RINOs and GOP establishment fools they are exactly that.

Conservative as a label is just a crutch for those who are too staid or unwilling to see how we can break the chains and hold GOP Establishment has enslaved us with. All of them willing abettors to liberals and Democrats ruling our lives.

My only question of you is if Trump wins the nomination, will you vote for him in the general election? If you won’t answer that, then we don’t have anything to discuss.


54 posted on 01/29/2016 6:39:31 AM PST by Gaffer
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To: Gaffer; ManHunter
I don’t want to hear about this sacrosanct ‘conservative’ altar anymore. [...] Conservative as a label is just a crutch for those who are too staid or unwilling to see how we can break the chains and hold GOP Establishment has enslaved us with.

At the cost of Conservative principles... You will obviously end up with nothing, because you eschew the only thing that will fix anything.

69 posted on 01/29/2016 6:47:02 AM PST by roamer_1 (Globalism is just Socialism in a business suit.)
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To: Gaffer

So, to Trump supporters - at least yourself, conservatism is now a crutch?

You and many others have repeatedly asked for citations, references and sources to things that indicate Trump may not be who he says he is. I and others provide those sources and citations and you respond with, “Don’t tell me all that stuff”, which equates to “Don’t confuse me with facts [even if they’re in Trump’s own words], I’ve made up my mind”, as you alluded to in your response.

My point is, positions like “Everybody’s got to be covered”, “I’m going to take care of everybody”, “The government’s gonna pay for it (health insurance)” - ALL in Trump’s own words, only four months ago are not one iota different than the positions of none other than Obama, Bernie Sanders or Hillary Clinton. Like Obama, Sanders and Clinton, Trump doesn’t recognize that health insurance is NOT health care.

The only person who has proposed a CONSTITUTIONAL and CONSERVATIVE (my “crutches”) alternative to Obamacare is Ted Cruz, as he has articulated in DETAIL for months on end: 1) Remove the barrier to interstate sales of insurance policies; 2) Allow individuals, not companies, to own their insurance policies and take those policies with them when they lose or change jobs; and 3) Allow the free market, not the government, to determine the cost of health insurance.

Do I have any questions about Ted Cruz on any issue? Absolutely! however, Cruz has, with very few exceptions, a consistently conservative record based on constitutional principles. Things like “His wife works for Goldman Sachs” or “He took out a loan with Goldman” don’t mean a damned thing, anymore than Trump’s multiple loans with Goldman and virtually every other large, international investment bank. Eight of the Republican presidential hopefuls, Trump, Cruz, Ben Carson, Jeb Bush, John Kasich, Carly Fiorina, Chris Christie, and Jim Gilmore said in financial disclosures that were filed between June and August of last year that they had owned Goldman funds or Goldman stock, and in some cases both. The disclosures mostly cover the period from the beginning of 2014 to the middle of last year (2015).

Citation: http://www.rawstory.com/2016/01/not-just-ted-cruz-most-gop-candidates-have-financial-ties-to-goldman-sachs/

What this really boils down to is that you and many other Trump supporters steadfastly refuse delivery of any information that contradicts your view of Donald Trump. I only hope you’re right in your blind dedication and belief.


141 posted on 01/29/2016 7:44:38 AM PST by ManHunter (You can run, but you'll only die tired... Army snipers: Reach out and touch someone)
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To: Gaffer

p.s. Apologies. I failed to answer your question as to whether or not I’d vote for Trump. My answer is an absolute, unequivocal no. I was willing to vote for him a few months ago, given his position on immigration at the outset, but he has attenuated his position on illegal immigration (including Muslim immigration) since, so I have serious doubts as to whether he still intends to do what he said in August.

On the positions that matter most to me (adherence to constitutional principles and federalism, the size of government, government regulations, the Second Amendment and health insurance), his record is inconsistent at best. Ergo, I have some doubts as to his current position on immigration and a lot of doubts on things that I consider inherently constitutional American positions. So no, I would not and will not vote for him in the primary or general election.

Unfortunately, as with every election thus far, we end up with the government we deserve/elect. God help us...


154 posted on 01/29/2016 8:00:42 AM PST by ManHunter (You can run, but you'll only die tired... Army snipers: Reach out and touch someone)
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