Posted on 09/19/2015 6:13:19 PM PDT by SoFloFreeper
“There is one very serious defect to my mind in Christ’s moral character, and that is that He believed in hell.” So wrote the agnostic British philosopher Bertrand Russell in 1967. The idea of eternal punishment for sin, he further notes, is “a doctrine that put cruelty in the world and gave the world generations of cruel torture.”
His views are at least more consistent than religious philosopher John Hick, who refers to hell as a “grim fantasy” that is not only “morally revolting” but also “a serious perversion of the Christian Gospel.” Worse yet was theologian Clark Pinnock who, despite having regarded himself as an evangelical, dismissed hell with a rhetorical question: “How can one imagine for a moment that the God who gave His Son to die for sinners because of His great love for them would install a torture chamber somewhere in the new creation in order to subject those who reject Him to everlasting pain?”
So, what should we think of hell? Is the idea of it really responsible for all the cruelty and torture in the world? Is the doctrine of hell incompatible with the way of Jesus Christ? Hardly. In fact, the most prolific teacher of hell in the Bible is Jesus, and He spoke more about it than He did about heaven. In Matthew 25:41–46 He teaches us four truths about hell that should cause us to grieve over the prospect of anyone experiencing its horrors.
1. Hell is a state of separation from God.
On the day of judgment, Jesus will say to all unbelievers, “Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire” (v. 41). This is the same sort of language that Jesus uses elsewhere to describe the final judgment of unbelievers (see 7:23).
To be separated from God is to be separated from anything and everything good. That is hard to conceive because even the most miserable person enjoys some of God’s blessings. We breathe His air, are nourished by food that He supplies, and experience many other aspects of His common grace.
On earth even atheists enjoy the benefits of God’s goodness. But in hell, these blessings will be nonexistent. Those consigned there will remember God’s goodness, and will even have some awareness of the unending pleasures of heaven, but they will have no access to them.
This does not mean that God will be completely absent from hell. He is and will remain omnipresent (Ps. 139:7-8). To be separated from the Lord and cast into hell does not mean that a person will finally be free of God. That person will remain eternally accountable to Him. He will remain Lord over the person’s existence. But in hell, a person will be forever separated from God in His kindness, mercy, grace, and goodness. He will be consigned to deal with Him in His holy wrath.
2. Hell is a state of association.
Jesus says that the eternal fire of hell was “prepared for the devil and his angels” (Matt. 25:41). People were made for God. Hell was made for the Devil. Yet people who die in their sin, without Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, will spend eternity in hell with the one being who is most unlike God. It is a tragic irony that many who do not believe in the Devil in this life will wind up spending eternity being tormented with him in hell.
3. Hell is a state of punishment.
Jesus describes it as “fire” (v. 41) and a place of “punishment” (v. 46). Hell is a place of retribution where justice is served through the payment for crimes.
The punishment must fit the crime. The misery and torment of hell point to the wickedness and seriousness of sin. Those who protest the biblical doctrine of hell as being excessive betray their inadequate comprehension of the sinfulness of sin. For sinners to be consigned to anything less than the horrors of eternal punishment would be a miscarriage of justice.
4. Hell is an everlasting state.
Though some would like to shorten the duration of this state, Jesus’ words are very clear. He uses the same adjective to describe both punishment and life in verse 46. If hell is not eternal, neither is the new heaven and earth.
How can God exact infinite punishment for a finite sin? First, because the person against whom all sin is committed is infinite. Crimes against the infinitely holy, infinitely kind, infinitely good, and infinitely supreme Ruler of the world deserve unending punishment. In addition to that, those condemned to hell will go on sinning for eternity. There is no repentance in hell. So the punishment will continue as long as the sinning does.
The dreadfulness of hell deepens our grateful praise for the salvation we have in Jesus Christ. Hell is what we deserve. And hell is what He experienced on the cross in our place.
Believing the truth about hell also motivates us to persuade people to be reconciled to God. By God’s grace those of us who are trusting Christ have been rescued from this horrible destiny. How can we love people and refuse to speak plainly to them about the realities of eternal damnation and God’s gracious provision of salvation?
Clearer visions of hell will give us greater love for both God and people.
This post was originally published in Tabletalk magazine.
And technical distinctions are made pertinent here:
Parables are extended figures of comparison that often use short stories to teach a truth or answer a question. While the story in a parable is not historical, it is true to life, not a fairy tale. As a form of oral literature, the parable exploits realistic situations but makes effective use of the imagination. Jesus frequently composed parables in His teaching ministry (see Mark 4:34) and used them in response to specific situations and challenges.
His parables are drawn from the spheres of domestic and family life as well as business and political affairs. He used imagery that was familiar to His hearers to guide them to the unfamiliar. Some of the parables were designed to reveal mysteries to those on the inside and to conceal the truth to those on the outside who would not hear (Matt. 13:10-17; Mark 4:10-12). This was especially true of the parables that related to the kingdom of God. However, other parables like the parable of the good Samaritan (Luke 10:25- 37) and the parable of the landowner (Matt. 21:33-46) could be grasped by unbelievers. — https://bible.org/seriespage/iv-literary-forms-bible
Parables are short stories that are told in order to get a point across and occur in both testaments of the Bible. The word "parable" (Gk. parabole) was generally used in reference to any short narrative that had symbolic meaning (Louw & Nida 1989, p. 391). There are many stories and saying of Jesus in the New Testament that are identified as parables, but not all of these are parables in the true sense. The Good Samaritan (Luke 10:30-35) may be regarded as a true parable because it is a complete story with a beginning, ending and plot, but the Leaven in the Meal is a similitude, "You are the salt of the earth" is a metaphor and "Do people pick grapes from thorn bushes" is an epigram (Fee & Stuart 1993, p. 136-137). When "parable" is used in this section it refers to the true parables. - — http://hermeneutics.kulikovskyonline.net/hermeneutics/parab.htm.
[[Now where have we seen that blasphemy before?]]
[[Arrogance]]
[[Yes, satan used the same methodology]]
[[What a disgusting twisted mind your religion has left you with]]
[[And you seemed like such a nice poster]]
Wish I could say the same for you- have a nice day
Thank you. Good information, and much appreciated. :)
Peace,
SR
“School me even though this conversation isn’t about the original comment chap and verse please. The Holy spirit remains in believers though we sin.”
Sorry been out of pocket. Ok you avoided my question, but now your back to the original question. I’ll say it again I completely agree that no power to include Satan or man can pluck you out of the Father’s hand, but You, yourself, your own person, or your own spirit can give your Salvation back.
Please look at the sower of seed story Luke 8:4-21 the seed that fell and was eaten by the birds represents people that don’t accept the Gospel, but the remainder have accepted the Good News. Some don’t last long at all some a little longer and well some produce fruit. Again please don’t think that I’m saying that the Devil can pluck you out of God’s hands, but to say that once saved all behavior of unrepentant sin will be forgiven is just wrong. God Bless
Zombies we are not, sower of the seed story completely disagrees with you.
Sorry life moves. Please look at the sower of seed story Luke 8:4-21 the seed that fell and was eaten by the birds represents people that don’t accept the Gospel, but the remainder have accepted the Good News. Some don’t last long at all some a little longer and well some produce fruit. Again please don’t think that I’m saying that the Devil can pluck you out of God’s hands, but to say that once saved all behavior of unrepentant sin will be forgiven is just wrong. God Bless
That said, what do you think of my strong recommendation that you meditate extensively on Eph. 2:8-9?
Being and AG major, a farmer and rancher I will disagree with you on the the “never adequately alive in the first place”. So a (seed) egg and (seed) sperm come together and is planted (womb or soil) and divides (germinates) that isn’t the beginning of life? Wow it grows and whether it makes it to one day or to a hundred it had life. So your saying that abortion is ok because the life didn’t live adequately. Being born “AGAIN” doesn’t refer to age, but to the act thereof.
Eph 2:8-9
Yes Grace a free gift given whether you accept it or not. Every person that has heard the message of Jesus Christ has had the opportunity to accept that Grace or reject it free will.
“multiple interpretations”
Multiple interpretations, No, but multiple applications yes.
Several points I want ot leave this thread with because people have the impression I am claiming Christ intentionally deceived people- And that is NOT what I was getting at at all- There have been some very angry people on this thread who insist Jesus wouldn’t do something ‘because He never had before’ Yet He set presidencies ALL the time- And those claiming He wouldn’t use something false in order to bring a spiritual lesson can’t tell you whether He actually infact told His audience that the=at was not how heaven and hell are going to be- These folks would also claim Christ would have told US too- yet the rest of God’s word (which they didn’t have back then) Tells us that Hell is a complete separation from God- that there is no crossable gulf, that it is forbidden to talk to the dead- on and on it goes- and the bible does NOT teach that people can be prayed out of a ‘first death’ as the MYTh taught by the Pharisees suggest.
The paradise Christ spoke of was the presence of God- not a holding ground outside of the kingdom of Heaven like in the myth- The kingdom of God has the tree of life in the garden with a river running through it- The Paradise of Myth does not- it is outside of the kingdom of God- many claiming it’s on earth while sheol is under the earth (That’s how they explain away the distance and the ability of the two sides to speak together)
Christ no more ‘deceived people’ by using the Pharisees own Myth against them, and turning it completely around to give life/spiritual lessons based on the myth, and He did when He said the sun rose in e east set in the west, or when the parable was given of trees electing a king for themselves- Or when He compared himself to things like vine, bread, wine etc- He was no more deceiving people than when God said “The 4 corners of the earth”, no any other ‘scientific error’ He might have said (Using common phrases or EVEN CONCEPTS EVEN IF they mythological in nature, in order to bring life/spiritual lessons to those who believe, is NOT speaking or teaching ‘scientific error’
I was accused of being ‘arrogant’ ‘obtuse’ ‘sick’ twisted’ etc- but the plain fact of the matter is that this issue about the parable of the rich man has been HEAVILY debated all down through the ages by many rock solid preachers, commentators, theologians, scholars- To state that I am sick and twisted simply because I relay what these people have taught, ESPECIALLY after I’ve stated that fact several times, IS the very definition or arrogance and obtuseness- To declare that the opposing view on THIS issue is cultish is completely uncalled for! To claim I am cultish because I subscribe to these views is Uncalled For!
There are many good reasons to think that This parable is NOT using a literal act that happened I nthe past, but rather is a purely fictional scene to teach a life/spiritual lesson JUST LIKE it is purely fictional to teach that trees elect a king’- yet the message is clear- and nooen would take EITHER o the scenarios literally, and there are only really two weak reason why you would think it’s an actual event or based on reality- 1: Christ never did it before, so therefore He’s prevented from ever doing so’ and 2: Christ would not teach ‘scientific error’- but we’ve seen that this is simply not true- My opponent tried to wave it away by claiming it was nothing ore than folk tale, or whatever he called it- but there are the facts folks-
[[2: Christ would not teach ‘scientific error’- but we’ve seen that this is simply not true- My opponent tried to wave it away by claiming it was nothing ore than folk tale, or whatever he called it- but there are the facts folks-]]
Let me clarify that, so that there is no confusion- Teaching, using something that isn’t a literal act, process, or object is NOT “teaching Scientific error”, No more so than Any metaphor that uses myth or fiction is ‘teaching that the fiction is truth’ they are simply life/spiritual lessons and nothing more- most people understand this-
God was NOT teaching the people that trees elect kings, nor Was Christ teaching the people that His body was made of bread and wine- if we are going to assign the term ‘scientific error’ to the parable of rich man, then we must do so for all the parables that used metaphors- metaphors used in parables were based on things that aren’t true- it is NOT true that Christ’s body is made of bread- no more so than the idea that people can be prayed out of purgatory, or cross the divide, or that paradise is a place outside of God’s kingdom-
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