Replies

“Now that is real honest to God pessimism
the question becomes, what will tip the balance?
so long as conservatives remain fragmented and apathetic,...... nothing”

The founding fathers attempted to work within the system in the early 1770’s, presenting their grievances to Parliament and the King. Not only were their pleas ignored, the government of England responded with more oppression.

Conservatives have no home in the Democrat Party. The blue dogs have been forced out and the leftists who control that party today are ideological purists who will tolerate no independent action or thought.

The behavior of the House of Representatives since Republicans captured a majority in 2010, the behavior of the Senate since the election of 2014, and the pronouncements of the leaders of the Republican Party demonstrate conservatives do not have a home in the GOP and are disdained by the party leaders.

There has not been one truly conservative GOP presidential candidate since 1984, Reagan’s last run for office. Until Romney in 2012, GOP candidates gave lip service to the conservative base when running but if given the chance to govern, behaved as moderates or liberals. Romney in 2012 actually fought conservatives bitterly in the primaries. Upon receiving the nomination he refused to engage the Tea Party and pushed conservatives to the side. He lost.

Jeb Bush, the favored son of the party elites, has clearly communicated he is not a conservative and does not intend to even provide lip service to conservatives. His vision for the party, and that of the establishment, is for a party that does not need conservative votes. They see the future as a two party America with the Democrats representing the Marxist redistributionists and the socialist corporatist Republican statists being effective managers of the nanny state for the benefit of large corporations. Both parties are run by globalists who disdain the concept of the nation state and embrace the utopian idea of the “global community”. Neither party’s leadership understands or cares about individual liberty. They are all collectivists.

The current two party system is not working. We have a dominant one party system in which the Republican Party acquiesces to the policies of the Democrat Party, even when it controls the legislature or White House.

A vibrant three party system would completely change the dynamic. In a multi party system, where no one party has an overwhelming majority, coalitions are required to govern. To form a coalition, the larger partner in the coalition must come to terms with another party in able to obtain support in the legislature. Coming to terms means advancing some of the agenda of the minority partner(s). Perhaps in a coalition government, the initially small, but passionate, conservative party could achieve guarantees the 2nd amendment will be left alone or real work will be done on addressing the national debt. Longer term, as the conservative party grows, it will gain more power. Something is better than the current nothing.

In Europe the corruption and ineptitude of the traditional large parties is resulting in the formation of new parties and shift in the political calculations and dynamics. In the UK for example, Nigal Farage and his party are becoming real factors. In Greece a minority party (leftist) has captured the government. Merkel in Germany is having to make policy with an eye to the growth of political parties on the right. Even in socialist Europe, citizens crave liberty and are taking action to push back on the oppression of the collectivist state.

Today conservatives are essentially powerless in national politics. The problem is not apathy, it is institutional. We are trying to influence policy inside a political party financially controlled by people and institutions opposed to us. They view us as a cancer cell, not partners. From the perspective of the professional political class who cares more about exercising power than ideology, money triumphs over passion or ideals. Pressing the case for conservative principles with Karl Rove, the Bush family, Mitt Romney, or the head of the Chamber of Commerce is no different than Benjamin Franklin presenting the English King a list of grievances. Their interests are not aligned with the people so they just don’t care and really don’t want to listen. Karl Rove and Mitch McConnell have more in common with Charles Schumer, with respect to lifestyle and social mores, than they have with the average middle class taxpayer in Mitch McConnell’s district. If Jeb Bush were honest, he’d tell you he would prefer to have dinner with Bill and Hillary Clinton than with a couple selected randomly from a middle class neighborhood within a few miles of his home.

At this point I see no way to reform the Republican Party from within. The fight inside the party is sapping the passion and energy of the conservative movement. People become apathetic when they see no reward from their best efforts.

The timing is right and the ingredients exist to form a viable new party. While conservative leaders may differ on policy, they are united in the knowledge the nation is going the wrong way and the uniquely American experiment in freedom is coming to an end. If they were put aside minor difference to unite on the core principles, as our founders came together in Philadelphia in the mid 1770’s to form a new party, I believe they could rally most conservative voters to come with them. There are no emotional bonds or economic bonds between conservatives and the Republican party, unlike the Democrat party which binds its voters with privileges and money drawn from the public treasury.

Leadership requires risk and personal sacrifice. Breaking free of the established order to form a new political entity requires personal risk and potentially great sacrifice. For some leaders it might mean putting aside forever personal ambitions for the greater good. For all of the current office holders it may initially mean loss of power and prestige as the established order goes into full attack mode to destroy them.

However, history shows that when leaders demonstrate courage and put their lives, fortunes, ambitions, and sacred honor at risk, people will follow. The question for our time is are the conservative leaders of today cut from the cloth of the founders or are they simply ambitious political hacks who can occasionally give a good speech?

——The problem is not apathy, ——

I chose apathy to mean lack of will to act or engage. To form a new party requires action and mental, financial, and physical engagement. I see no realistic possibility of the coalescence of those three to develop a third party with any significance.

Free Republic is a good example of cross sectional conservatism. There is lots of hot air but there is no desire to act, there is not even a large desire to make a financial commitment. most of the money comes from a rather small percentage of Freepers.And were it not for some big donations from a very few, even that might not be adequate to keep the servers humming. (analyze the oft posted list of donations) Most importantly, there is wide disagreement on key matters that is so selfishly guarded that there is no coalescence to produce political power. Most importantly, there is apparently no money for a third party.

The most common action on Free Republic besides typing is to pray. Prayer is an excuse..... let God do it, and then having made that action ....nothing. If God won’t will it, then well, not really anything I am willing to do either

Then there is the Tea Party. The TP was never and is not now a party. the TP is an idea, a concept, a desire. I live in one of the most conservative congressional districts in the country, a Republican district, nary a Democrat need run for congress. I was flabbergasted at the turnout for Tea Party rallies a year or so back. But now? No action, no leadership springing from the grass roots, no demonstrations, nothing. We sent a conservative to congress but he defeated the super conservative evangelical that was elected in a race of 5 candidates. He lost to the present congressman Dr Roe in the next election

If there is to be a weilding of conservative power, it will not be by a third party. The power will be, must be, wielded from within the Republican party. Those wielding the power are the GOPc, the conservative wing. We have seen just this week that there are enough to disrupt and cause negotiation to at least temper legislation

Lastly, regarding leaders, those running for President know that a third party serves no purpose. Were it so, Ted Cruz would not bee a Republican