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Ukraine needs America’s help
Washington Post ^ | January 29 at 8:12 PM | Steven Pifer and Strobe Talbott

Posted on 01/30/2015 12:35:40 PM PST by UMCRevMom@aol.com

click here to read article


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To: PieterCasparzen

I’m probably older & I agree with you The Methodist have been greatly influenced by the left-leaning profs left in seminary that were products of 60’s 70’s politics. Being United Methodist, you know then that the General Board of Church & Society is basically ignored. In fact the year I was ordained, a member of the GBSC told me liberals go there to hide out during a Republican administration! That being said, the left has always been greatly over-balanced by the UMC conservative grass roots :)

P.S.
I was born & raised in Detroit. I remember John Kerry [now secretary of state!) came to Wayne State University with his ‘Winter Soldier’ pack of lies! Later when military investigators asked the “winter soldiers” for evidence of all the war crimes they had alleged, they went clintonesk by stonewalling, backtracking, and giving statements that failed to support the Vietnam Veterans Against the War (VVAW’s claims)
Check out: http://www.wintersoldier.com/

If interested go to http://www.wintersoldier.com/


121 posted on 01/31/2015 9:27:35 AM PST by UMCRevMom@aol.com
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To: PieterCasparzen

Pieter.. This may help:
http://www.umc.org/what-we-believe/foundational-documents

I post pro-life or comment on misc. topics. However, I typically post about Ukraine because I have friends and know suffering under Russian occupation.


122 posted on 01/31/2015 9:40:00 AM PST by UMCRevMom@aol.com
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To: UMCRevMom@aol.com

‘cuse please... I need to stop posting when running anti-virus/malware!

I post pro-life or comment on misc. topics. However, I typically post about Ukraine because I have friends and know CLERGY currently suffering in Ukraine under Russian occupation.


123 posted on 01/31/2015 9:46:50 AM PST by UMCRevMom@aol.com
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To: Jim Noble
I mean, look at the quality of the responses from the pro-interventionists - accusing long term FReepers of wanting to have sex with Putin, or being on the Russian payroll, among other things.

And look at the appeasers . . . to them everyone is a warmonger and there is a banker behind them pulling the strings.

124 posted on 01/31/2015 10:16:30 AM PST by 1rudeboy
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To: tcrlaf

basic anti-tank munitions aren’t very expensive, if all else fails we could do a lend/lease program. There are ways to help without creating a mountain of debt.


125 posted on 01/31/2015 10:36:44 AM PST by MeatshieldActual (Texan Independence, now and forever!)
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To: UMCRevMom@aol.com

And there’s this link:

http://www.umc.org/what-we-believe/social-principles-social-creed

“To help guide our thinking and acting about how we live in, and are in engaged in ministry in the world, The United Methodist Church has created statements to guide the church in its efforts to create a world of justice.”
...

and this...

http://www.umc.org/what-we-believe/economic-community

“We claim all economic systems to be under the judgment of God no less than other facets of the created order. Therefore, we recognize the responsibility of governments to develop and implement sound fiscal and monetary policies that provide for the economic life of individuals and corporate entities and that ensure full employment and adequate incomes with a minimum of inflation. We believe private and public economic enterprises are responsible for the social costs of doing business, such as employment and environmental pollution, and that they should be held accountable for these costs. We support measures that would reduce the concentration of wealth in the hands of a few. We further support efforts to revise tax structures and to eliminate governmental support programs that now benefit the wealthy at the expense of other persons.
Property

We believe private ownership of property is a trusteeship under God, both in those societies where it is encouraged and where it is discouraged, but is limited by the overriding needs of society. We believe that Christian faith denies to any person or group of persons exclusive and arbitrary control of any other part of the created universe. Socially and culturally conditioned ownership of property is, therefore, to be considered a responsibility to God. We believe, therefore, governments have the responsibility, in the pursuit of justice and order under law, to provide procedures that protect the rights of the whole society as well as those of private ownership.
Collective Bargaining

We support the right of all public and private employees and employers to organize for collective bargaining into unions and other groups of their own choosing. Further, we support the right of both parties to protection in so doing and their responsibility to bargain in good faith within the framework of the public interest. In order that the rights of all members of the society may be maintained and promoted, we support innovative bargaining procedures that include representatives of the public interest in negotiation and settlement of labor-management contracts, including some that may lead to forms of judicial resolution of issues. We reject the use of violence by either party during collective bargaining or any labor/management disagreement. We likewise reject the permanent replacement of a worker who engages in a lawful strike.”
...


126 posted on 01/31/2015 11:27:58 AM PST by PieterCasparzen (Repent !)
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To: UMCRevMom@aol.com


http://empr.media/opinion/analytics/four-paths-to-the-hague-for-lpr-and-dpr-terrorists
127 posted on 01/31/2015 12:11:03 PM PST by AdmSmith (GCTGATATGTCTATGATTACTCAT)
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To: SunkenCiv

Even Lukashenko in Belarus is worried about the resurrection of Soviet Union 2.0, at least if Putin want to take “his” country:

“If there are some pundits here who believe that the Belarusian land is a part, as they say now, of the so-called ‘Russian world’ or rather Russian… Forget about it. We have always been hospitable to anyone. But we will make everyone to respect our sovereignty and our independence,” he said.

“Somebody thinks that there was no such country… It was not, but now it exists, and this must be considered. And we will not give our land to anyone,” Lukashenko said.

http://www.unian.info/politics/1038195-lukashenko-belarus-is-not-part-of-russian-world.html


128 posted on 01/31/2015 12:17:37 PM PST by AdmSmith (GCTGATATGTCTATGATTACTCAT)
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To: Cossak

“Ukrainian men are fleeing by thousands to Russia from mobilization.”

“The fourth wave of mobilization is problematic,” Ukraine army spokesman, Vladimir Talalay acknowledged on Saturday. “The biggest difficulties are seen in Sumy, Kharkov, Cherkassy, Ternopol, Zakarpatye and other regions.”

Western Ukrainians (Hungarians) are fleeing the conscription in droves.


129 posted on 01/31/2015 12:27:12 PM PST by tcrlaf (They told me it could never happen in America. And then it did....)
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To: tcrlaf

Unconfirmed reports that Semenchenko (NAZI battalion “Donbas” Commander) was badly wounded in an attempted counter-attack near Uglegorsk.


130 posted on 01/31/2015 12:33:09 PM PST by tcrlaf (They told me it could never happen in America. And then it did....)
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To: tcrlaf

More on Senemchenko from twitter:

“Donbas” was ambushed by NAF on the road Debaltsevo - Uglegorsk

Sounds like it was Givi’s crew, that was reported to have arrived in Uglegorsk from Donetsk yesterday.


131 posted on 01/31/2015 12:44:07 PM PST by tcrlaf (They told me it could never happen in America. And then it did....)
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To: UMCRevMom@aol.com
This war is because a minority of Ukies want to align themselves with the E.U. and have the latte-drinking socialist life of your everyday unemployed Greek or Frenchman on the dole.

Keep us the F out of it... and out of WWIII. We have our own civil war to wage.

132 posted on 01/31/2015 1:49:07 PM PST by Rodamala
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To: All

“1 The relationship between the Kremlin and Russian organised crime syndicates around the world is so close as to make the two effectively indistinguishable, said Ben Emmerson QC, counsel for Mrs Litvinenko. The startling truth will be revealed in evidence showing how the Russian mafia is controlled directly from the office of Mr Putin.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/11381789/The-assassination-of-Alexander-Litvinenko-20-things-about-his-death-we-have-learned-this-week.html


133 posted on 01/31/2015 4:05:18 PM PST by BeadCounter
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To: AdmSmith

thank you for your post & link


134 posted on 01/31/2015 4:09:29 PM PST by UMCRevMom@aol.com
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To: BeadCounter

thank you this article. I remember reading something about organized crime & the Putin link earlier


135 posted on 01/31/2015 4:13:10 PM PST by UMCRevMom@aol.com
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To: UMCRevMom@aol.com

We’ve got our OWN communist insurgency to deal with first, before we worry about Ukraine.

Half the reason we are where we are right now is because we spend too much time and attention on everyone else, while we’re being internally subverted.

If Ukraine wants to be free, let her fight for her own independence, like we had - and have - to.


136 posted on 01/31/2015 8:53:43 PM PST by NFHale (The Second Amendment - By Any Means Necessary.)
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To: UMCRevMom@aol.com
I post pro-life or comment on misc. topics. However, I typically post about Ukraine because I have friends and know CLERGY currently suffering in Ukraine under Russian occupation.

I've only ever seen your Ukraine posts.

You might wish to contact the United Methodist clergy that lead many United Methodist Churches in Russia itself.

Here's the info for the UMC Bishop in Moscow:

The Eurasia Area

Office:
Khamovnichesky val 24, stroenie 2, Moscow 119048, Russia
T +7 495 961 3458 - F +7 495 961 3458 (not authomatic)
E office(at)umc-eurasia.ru

Bishop Eduard Khegay
T +7 495 961 3458
E bishop.eduard(at)umc-eurasia.ru

More info at the link:

http://www.umc-northerneurope.org/

I wonder if the Russian UMC Churches are doing ok under Russian rule inside Russia ? Perhaps they can speak with the elites of Russia and see if they can't go easy on UMC Church leadership in Ukraine, perhaps set aside special areas for clergy who are not involved in the conflict. Well, I assume they are not involved in the conflict - they don't support either side, right ? They just do purely humanitarian work, like aiding the poor and the sick, regardless of which side they are on ?

Of course, it's up to them if they want to get involved and support one side or the other. Missionaries in wars often do that, but such actions come with the understanding that they are placing themselves at far greater risk than if they stayed politically neutral.

Of course, everyone needs to keep in mind that when they leave the country they are a citizen of and go to a foreign country, they lose the protection of their home country, which has no jurisdiction inside another country. I mean, it's not like me, private citizen, can count on the US military to come rescue me if I'm in a foreign country and I get in trouble there.
137 posted on 01/31/2015 9:34:29 PM PST by PieterCasparzen (Repent !)
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To: 2banana; All
Through violence, intimidation and western support - that government was overthrown and an illegal government was put in power. But somehow that is a GOOD THING.

Stop reading Alex Jones, Commie or Ron Paul websites. The "violence, intimidation" came from the puppet government from Moscow which was beating people up and kidnapping people for months before the Ukrainians came out in force. The "western support" nonsense is the big lie from Moscow and its Communist sympathizers which want us to believe that no Ukrainian in his right mind would actually stand up to his or her government when they are establishing a dictatorship.

138 posted on 01/31/2015 10:28:12 PM PST by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: demshateGod
Illegal or not, this is the bed they made. We should never get into another war until we have a good house cleaning.

Yeah, like the Poles made their bed by not immediately surrendering to the Nazi war machine.

You're not a conservative.

139 posted on 01/31/2015 10:30:22 PM PST by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Jim Noble
Then they're stupid.

Guess you weren't a fan of the American revolution?

140 posted on 01/31/2015 10:31:37 PM PST by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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