Kadner: A British policeman learns much about policing in America (Barf alert)

Southtown/Star Chicago ^ | Oct 29, 2014 | Phil Kadner

[KeyLargo]

Kadner: A British policeman learns much about policing in America

By Phil Kadner pkadner@southtownstar.com October 29, 2014 6:30PM

Sergeant Gary Watters, a 14 year veteran of the Greater Manchester Police department, works on the computer at the Park Forest Police Department. Officer Watters is working with the Park Forest Police Department as part of a work exchange program at the Park Forest Police Department

Much of my time with Gary Watters, a sergeant in the United Kingdom’s Greater Manchester Police Department, was spent talking about guns — or the lack of them.

I just couldn’t understand how police officers in England manage to arrest a criminal without carrying a sidearm.

Watters spent October with the Park Forest Police Department as part of a professional/cultural exchange program sponsored by the International Police Association.

At 42, Watters has spent 14 years working for the Greater Manchester PD, including a couple of years in what they call a firearms unit, which means he was among the 2 percent of all law enforcement in England allowed to carry a gun on the job.

“The attitudes toward guns is certainly one of the greatest differences in our countries,” he told me.

Handgun ownership is banned in England, and limited permits for shotguns and rifles are issued by the government.

Watters explained that the typical patrol officer is equipped with a baton, CS spray (a sort of tear gas) and “some even have Tasers.” He said that as if no other explanation for a lack of weaponry was necessary.

But he knows that Americans are dumbstruck by the notion that police can patrol city streets without a gun.

[Georgia Girl 2]

“I know my country has problems”

Here’s what I know to a metaphysical certitude; I can own a weapon and I don’t need a license to do it. I can have a handgun, a shotgun, an AK, an AR, any high capacity mag I want and its my inalienable (God given) right to do it. I can leave my guns laying around anywhere in or on my property fully loaded. I can carry a gun in my car. I can keep a gun at my office. The government has no right to stop me from exercising my God given right. The fact that some nutjob shoots up a school does not trump my right to own and carry a weapon. The fact that some nutjob shoots up a movie theatre does not trump my right to own and carry a weapon. And it never will. The UK has given up their inalienable rights. Sad but true.

I spoke to the Lord today and he told me I’m OK but you are pretty well fooked. LOL!

[KeyLargo]

“I know you like to live in a dream world and I don’t blame you. If I lived in the UK I would just stay on crack 24/7 to delude myself.”

LOL.

That poster, who claims to be an expert on all things UK should really go over to Democrat Underground where his views would be better appreciated.

Personally I have NO desire to sign up to a conservative blog originating in the UK.

Ooops, oh never mind I think the only blogs that they have in the UK are Muslim now.....sarc.

“After Christianity, Islam was the most common faith with 42.6 thousand people in Scotland describing their religion as Muslim”

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/publications/2005/02/20757/53570

[Natty Bumppo@frontier.net]

Scotsman,

Thank you for correctly pointing out that the people of Great Britain are citizens and not subjects.

The case is not as clear cut regarding possession of firearms by the citizens of Great Britain.

According to United Kingdom 2011 census, the population of Great Britain was 63,181,175, of whom 51,808,563 were over the age of 14.

According to the Guide on Firearms Licensing Law, published in October 2014, there are 620,000 shotgun licenses in the United Kingdom (1.2% of the adult population) and 170,000 firearms liacenses (0.3% of the adult population.)

From the same document:

Gun ownership is a privilege, not a right.

“Small firearms,” defined as those having a barrel shorter than 30cm or a total length of less than 60 cm are prohibited. Thus, while handguns are not explicitly banned; effectively, it is illegal to possess or shoot one, except for very narrow, specialized, applications such as in a slaughterhouse or a starter’s pistol for a track meet.

Semi-automatic or pump action rifles or shotguns, other than .22 cal rimfire, are prohibited.

Expanding ammunition (hollow point) is prohibited except for deer hunting, vermin extermination, or humane killing of animals.

Depending upon purpose and use, various “guidelines” for possession of ammunition are provided, varying from 250 to 1000 rounds. in any case, bulk purchase of ammunition for the purpose of economy is not acceptable as good reason for possession.

Applications for the grant of a firearm certificate for the applicant’s or another’s protection, or that of premises, should be refused on the grounds that firearms are not an acceptable means of protection in Great Britain.

Scotsman, you are a better man than I am for being able to live under and lawfully comply with that array of firearms laws and regulations.

On my trip to the range this week, I will salute you with a few rounds from each of my weapons that would be illegal in the United Kingdom. Hint: It will be more than a 21-gun salute.

[the scotsman]

I do not claim to be an expert, but as I AM actually British, born and bred for nearly 45 years, I AM an expert on the UK in comparison to the rest of FreeRepublic (with the exception of other British and Irish freepers OR American freepers who have lived here or live here)....

Scots Muslims?. 42.6 out of 5.5m. A number that’s stayed steady, unlike English muslim numbers.

[KeyLargo]

So in other words you joined FR in support of Obama and as the designated educator to enlighten all of us 'Ugly Americans' on how wonderful and progressive the UK is compared to us backward rubes her in these United States of America.

U.K.

Obama: So Loved in Britain, He Might Consider Staying By Catherine Mayer @catherine_mayerMay 23, 2011

http://world.time.com/2011/05/23/obama-so-loved-in-britain-he-might-consider-staying/

[Georgia Girl 2]

I’m cleaning my gun so I can carry it to the grocery store with me in case one of the followers of the religion of peace decides to try to practice on me. LOL!

[the scotsman]

What?. What the hell are you smoking?.

I am a British conservative, a Tory or UKIP voter, and I loath Obama.

[KeyLargo]

“What?. What the hell are you smoking?.”

I have never smoked anything unlike your idol Mr. Cameron who is apparently also a Pot smoker just like Obama.

“David Cameron, the current Prime Minister of the United Kingdom and leader of the Conservative Party, has not clearly communicated whether he has used cannabis but he has clearly stated that he is “not issuing denials” about the stories on the front pages of several national newspapers claiming that he had. He did however, while Leader of the Opposition, say, that he supports the legalisation of medical cannabis.[21]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_British_politicians_who_admit_to_cannabis_use

“I am a British conservative”

Well isn’t that special.

Thank you for letting us know that you agree with the Democrats here on the majority of their stands.

So that make you a Democrat here in the U.S.

Aug 2, 2013 1:28PM ET
How Conservative Would British Conservatives Be in the U.S.?
Philip Bump

The Conservative Party of the United Kingdom has hired an unexpected-but-certainly-qualified person to advise its general election team: Jim Messina, architect of the Barack Obama re-election and former Deputy White House Chief of Staff. What gives? How could a self-described lifelong Democrat go work for the Conservatives?

In short: Money. But also because the U.K. Conservatives are not like U.S. conservatives.

Let’s be clear: This is not a Benedict Arnold-style move. The BBC reports on the hire, noting that Messina will remain in the U.S. (where Messina runs Organizing For Action) and will be used largely to advise on social media and campaign structure. The outlet also notes that it’s not the first time the Conservatives and the Obama team have been linked.

In the run-up to the TV debates of the 2010 U.K. general election campaign, the Tories brought Obama adviser Anita Dunne over to advise Mr .Cameron on how to handle the debates, which are a familiar feature of U.S. presidential races.

Then, in the year of the presidential election, Mr. Cameron flew to the US in a trip interpreted by many as an endorsement of Mr. Obama.

When you break down the parties (and their leaders) by policy, it’s easy to see why.

See graphic on this page.

Yes, that’s right: Messina can still wear his all-blue outfit when he has to take meetings in London.

The final tally from the above? Two Conservative policies similar to the Republican party; six to the Democrats. And in two instances — the death penalty and nationalized healthcare — it runs further to the left.

In other words, Messina doesn’t need to change his policy arguments that much, either.

http://www.thewire.com/politics/2013/08/how-conservative-would-uk-conservatives-be-us/67930/

[the scotsman]

1—I don’t like Cameron, I never wanted him to be Tory leader let alone PM.

2—Why do you insist I have stated I support democratic policy in the US?. Firstly, I don’t, secondly, frankly I don’t care about US domestic policy, I only care domestically about the UK. BTW, I would be very much a Republican if I was American. At ‘worst’, libertarian on some issues. I am not, never have been and never will be socialist.

Your posts to me have been completely wrong and frankly OTT in regards to what I am supposed to believe.

I am British, lifelong conservative, vote Tory or increasingly UKIP, I hate socialism, I believe in limited immigration, capitalism, a free economic system unfettered by socialism, a strong military, the ‘Anglosphere’........

[KeyLargo]

My fourth great-grandfather, a soldier along with his brother and two cousins in the New Hampshire Militia fought alongside their fellow compatriots and defeated the British and their paid German mercenaries at the Battle of Bennington.

My fourth great-grandfather would laugh now at one of the current British subjects attempting to lecture one of his fourth great-grandchildren on the wonders of being a resident of a ‘Progressive’ loser island.

The Revolutionary War (American War of Independence)
1777 - Our cannon is captured by General John Stark from the British in the Battle of Bennington.

By 1777 the American soldiers who had fought alongside the British against the French in Quebec were now fighting for independence from Great Britain. British General John Burgoyne led an army south from Quebec in attempt to separate New England from the other American colonies. In August, Burgoyne sent a detachment of about 800 Hessian (German) troops under the command of Lieutenant Colonel Friedrich Baum towards Bennington, Vermont to steal some horses and cattle. Baum was opposed by General John Stark, who led a New Hampshire Militia of 1,500 men. Stark had been ordered to march to Saratoga, New York, but was ignoring these orders.

When he encountered the Hessians, Stark reputedly told his militia men “There are your enemies, the Red Coats and the Tories. They are ours, or this night Molly Stark sleeps a widow!” (Note: the General’s wife, Molly Page Stark, grew up in the Dunbarton, New Hampshire house which still stands on Route 13 by Page’s Corner.)

Colonel Baum was inexperienced, hampered by his inability to speak English, and outnumbered. He requested reinforcements, and Burgoyne sent another 600 Hessian troops led by Colonel Heinrich von Breymann. However, von Breymann disliked Baum so he marched his men as slowly as possible and arrived after Baum and his troops had surrendered. After more fighting, von Breymann retreated, leaving behind all of his artillery pieces.

American casualties were 30 killed and 40 wounded. British losses were 200 killed and 700 captured. It was a great American victory.

http://www.newbostonhistoricalsociety.com/cannon.html#1777

[the scotsman]

And I am laughing at your ignorance that I am a subject. I am not, and never have been, given that I was born well past the 1st January 1949, when the British Nationality Act 1948 came into being, which clearly states in law that all British people are citizens. Your comment solidifies for me my idea that you are quite ignorant about the UK.

BTW, its the progressive loser UK that has a conservative govt and leader currently, not the US. Its the progressive loser UK that has UKIP, a truly conservative party, as the fastest growing political party in the country.

I don’t know what your beef is with my nation. Clearly we rankle you for some reason. Frankly, life is short and I don’t care.

[KeyLargo]

“BTW, its the progressive loser UK that has a conservative govt and leader currently, not the US.”

Thanks, I needed a good laugh over your phony Conservative UK Party!

Here is a simple comparison of your so-called UK ‘Conservative Party and the U.S. Republican Party:

Policy Republican Party
Abortion Oppose
Death penalty Support
Same-sex marriage Oppose
National healthcare
policy Oppose
Renewable energy Oppose
Carbon tax Oppose

U.K. Conservatives
Abortion - Support, but limit
Death penalty Oppose
Same-sex marriage Support
National healthcare policy Support
Renewable energy Support
Carbon tax Support

Source: http://www.thewire.com/politics/2013/08/how-conservative-would-uk-conservatives-be-us/67930/

It appears that your ‘Conservative Party’ fits very well with the Obama Democrat Party.

[KeyLargo]

“BTW, its the progressive loser UK that has a conservative govt and leader currently, not the US. “

If this recognition of Palestine as a state is but one example of your so-called Conservatives, then I would not be so proud to boast as much about the marvels of the UK.

British Parliament Votes to Recognize ‘Palestine’
British lawmakers vote overwhelmingly in favor of a non-binding motion recognizing the “state of Palestine”.
By Elad Benari
First Publish: 10/14/2014, 12:29 AM

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3214797/posts