Christie's controversial Ebola quarantine now embraced by Nobel Prize-winning doctor

nj ^ | 10/28/14

[knak]

TRENTON — After days of blistering criticism from the ACLU, the CDC and even the United Nations secretary general over Gov. Chris Christie’s new, 21-day mandatory quarantine policy for all healthcare workers exposed to Ebola, the New Jersey governor has gotten a much-needed vote of support from a heavyweight name in the medical community: Nobel Prize-winning doctor and medical researcher, Dr. Bruce Beutler.

Dr. Beutler, an American medical doctor and researcher, won the Nobel Prize for Medicine and Physiology in 2011 for his work researching the cellular subsystem of the body’s overall immune system — the part of it that defends the body from infection by other organisms, like Ebola.

snip: It may not be absolutely true that those without symptoms can’t transmit the disease, because we don’t have the numbers to back that up,” said Beutler, “It could be people develop significant viremia [where viruses enter the bloodstream and gain access to the rest of the body], and become able to transmit the disease before they have a fever, even. People may have said that without symptoms you can’t transmit Ebola. I’m not sure about that being 100 percent true. There’s a lot of variation with viruses.”

[greeneyes]

Thanks for pointing that out.

[Steelers6]

The Obamaphone and teleprompter will be making a visit to the Dr.’s employer pronto

[BeadCounter]

Or his computer might get hacked.

[Ozymandias Ghost]

“I have wondered if the most recent strain of Ebola had been studied in a sufficiently controlled environment to support the absolutes being offered by Prince Obie’s administration...”
_____________________

There was a doctor on Jeanine Pirro’s show on Fox this past Saturday who indicated that the current guidance is based upon 1600 cases from previous outbreaks. He stated that none of the guidelines are based upon data from the current epidemic. His position is that we do not know enough about Ebola virus in general; and, particularly, the current epidemic to make absolute statements regarding it's communicability.

I note that Dr Brantley has stated he does not believe that he became infected while in the Ebola ward treating patients or while being decontaminated. He believes he contracted the virus somewhere else; which, to me, implies he either became infected from a contaminated surface or a patient infected w/Ebola that was asymptomatic. (He stated that when he was treating non-Ebola patients that he did not wear full PPE.)

[gov_bean_ counter]

Thank you for that information.

[Chgogal]

Ping

[null and void]

Bring out your dead! The Dark Man cometh! Bring out your dead! The Dark Man cometh! Bring out your......

(hat tip to: fivecatsandadog!)

Post to me or FReep mail to be on/off the Bring Out Your Dead ping list.

The purpose of the “Bring Out Your Dead” ping list (formerly the “Ebola” ping list) is very early warning of emerging pandemics, as such it has a high false positive rate.

So far the false positive rate is 100%.

At some point we may well have a high mortality pandemic, and likely as not the “Bring Out Your Dead” threads will miss the beginning entirely.

*sigh* Such is life, and death...

[amihow]

I remember personally and have heard first hand accounts of quarantines in the days when reason, rather than leftist feelings dominated society.

The person exposed was quarantined in a place, usually their home for the duration of the incubation period. There was a huge sign on the door announcing the quarantine. They did not leave. Food, medicine and needs were delivered to the doorstep and left there. When the incubation period was over, they were allowed to go out.

Stupid politicians and poorly trained doctors would have never behaved like our current crop. They did not play Russian Roulette with the citizens of their country. They loved their people and their professions.

These idiots we have now are political and professional narcissits who do not care for anyone. Just their own, unethical and unprofessional opinions. Shame on them and their ilk.

[amihow]

And P.S. Remember, the few people treated in the United States have had very specialized treatment such as great supportive care, anti-viral meds and transfusions from recovered patients. Such treatment will NOT be available for you or me. Maybe for Obama and his minions, but not for us. There is not enough of that type of treatment to go around very far.

If people are brought here for treatment it will spread quickly and be a disaster.

[srmorton]

When you are uncertain and dealing with a pathogen of such high transmissability and lethality you take the most rigorous precautions...

I agree completely! I am not a doctor, but I have been teaching clinical microbiology to Medical Laboratory Technology students for over 30 years.

[Smokin' Joe]

Ping...

A link to this thread has been posted on the Ebola Surveillance Thread

[Palio di Siena]

How about transmission through flatulence?

[Ann Archy]

Who the hell is that in the red circle??

[Ancesthntr]

The problem with Christie’s quarantine (besides the fact that it doesn’t exist any longer) is that it depends on people telling investigators the truth. Note that it covers those coming from West Africa (OK, can’t really fool anyone there - this is a good start) WHO HAVE HAD CLOSE CONTACT WITH EBOLA PATIENTS.

Uh, excuse me, but Thomas Duncan got into this country from West Africa and LIED about close contact with Ebola patients. This quarantine would not have stopped him.

Further, even if someone is suspicious and they “super investigate” him (with a thermometer - wow, what a high-tech instrument, was it invented by the CIA?), you still have the problem that: a) it is easy to mask a high temperature on a temporary basis with aspirin or some other pain reliever (more high-tech stuff); b) 5% are asymptomatic after 21 days and 2% after 42(!!!) days; and c) many people don’t manifest Ebola with a high temp (up to 13% NEVER show a high temp until they are in the final stages of the disease (and then they aren’t traveling on their own power).

As mentioned, even a 21-day period only gets 95% of the people with Ebola. Sorry, but I’m not too partial to having a 5% error rate on a communicable disease with a 70% fatality rate (which fatalities occur only after your insides are liquified). Thanks, but no thanks.

Christie’s quarantine is, at best, a half measure. The only guaranteed measure is to do as the Aussies have done - revoke visas for ANYONE coming from West Africa, PERIOD. If they are a citizen or permanent resident, into quarantine for at least 60 days. Don’t like it? T.S. - then don’t go to that $hithole to begin with or, if you do, understand and deal with the quarantine on the back end of your trip.

[null and void]

Dunno. Sure looks like obama, though...

[exDemMom]

Actually, the CDC has now changed their position and now state that Ebola CAN be transmitted via airborne transmission up to 3 feet away through spittle, sneezing, coughing, and puking.

That is droplet transmission, not airborne transmission. The CDC, WHO, and every scientist and healthcare provider that are familiar with Ebola have *always* said that it can be transmitted by droplets. Droplet transmission is a form of direct transmission.

Viruses that are transmitted by air, like measles, can remain suspended in air for hours, and can be transported by air currents several feet or yards away from their source. Ebola has never been observed to transmit in this manner. If Ebola could transmit by the airborne route, it would be all over the world by now, infecting millions.

[exDemMom]

A blood test for virus does not look for actual virus particles, but actually the antibodies produced in response to infection. So it’s possible to have the virus and not yet have a detectable immune response.

It takes one or two weeks for the body to start producing antibodies. While looking for antibodies is a good way to find evidence of past infection, it won't pick up an infection early in the process.

Blood is tested for Ebola by doing a PCR assay, which detects virus RNA. When a person first becomes symptomatic, the PCR test is often negative, but it will be positive a day or so later. Whether this means there is no virus in the blood at that time, or the amount is too low to be detected is an unknown.

Many infections that are diagnosed by PCR of the blood behave the same way--not detectable right away, but are detectable a day or a few days later.

[steerpike100]

I’m glad that you looked it up.

Here’s the thing: people don’t go to the hospital until they feel sick. But already, the virus has been incubating and multiplying for 6 days, on average. The consequences of the viral load at day 6 are such that the host victim starts feeling sick, and there’s probably a fever.

Depending on the individual circumstances, the host victim may or may not seek medical attention at this point. Within a day or two more, probably.

The doctor/nurse looking at the symptoms may or may not suspect Ebola. Let’s say, it’s the U.S., and the CDC has recommended that blood tests be done, but no more than that.

Two days later the result comes in negative. But the victim is actually positive, and is now gravely ill. A new test is done, and a day or two later is confirmed for Ebola.

Or, the test is done, and comes back two days later, and is positive. The victim, now gravely ill, is quarantined in some manner.

Let’s go back to day 5. Ebola is multiplying, but the victim is still feeling OK—maybe a bit under the weather. He goes across town on public transportation to go bowling.

He’s a carrier of the virus. It’s in his system. That means he’s infectious to some degree other than zero. There are scenarios anyone can concoct that would lead to infection of others at day 5.

[exDemMom]

I think that initially, the virus replicates in the liver.

The guidelines are that if someone is a high risk patient, and they present with the symptoms, they will be quarantined until Ebola can be ruled out, and this does mean tests a couple of days apart.

[steerpike100]

That’s not true. The virus doesn’t magically seek out the liver. It has the ability to enter and reprogram several different cell types.