Posted on 07/23/2014 5:01:03 AM PDT by ButThreeLeftsDo
KIEV, Ukraine – Two Ukrainian military fighter jets have been shot down in the east, according to the country's Defense Ministry.
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
“Who declared THAT AREA a Cease Fire Zone???”
uhh...
Both Poroshenko and the rebels did.
And you, of course, already know that. So why the dog-whiste BS?
You are wrong. Ukraine did exist as a separate country. Indeed, for several centuries it was the center of Rus civilization. You might as well argue that Poland never existed as a separate country.
Ukraine became a part of the Russian Empire under Peter the Great, much like Scotland became part of the UK. It was not absorbed, it was attached.
Ukraine was never called Novorossiya. That is like saying that South Dakota was once called the Black Hills. Novorossiya is a separately defined area within the Ukraine, which was liberated from the Turks.
Again, like Scotland and the UK, it is not correct to look at Ukraine as a former Russian (as now defined) possession. During the time of the tzars, Ukrainians made up a good portion of the ruling elite of the Empire, but Ukraine maintained a separate identity within the Empire.
If you go to Wales, you will discover that the Welsh language appears first on signage. Should the English immigrants revolt? Indeed, should those who only speak Spanish in the SW revolt at the idea of English being an official language?
Troops may not fire nor conduct military ops in 40km #MH17 crash zone - Poroshenko http://on.rt.com/1q9y34
A Caucasian man can hate the entire Caucasian ethnic group AS SUCH. It is racism. Racism is not limited by the skin tone.
The best example are the German Nazis who considered all Slavic people to be untermensch (lesser than human).
German Nazis were racists. Exposing them is NOT a "race card". That's what I am talking about here.
You are pulling straw man here.
The massive use of logical fallacies, semi truths and omissions has nothing to do with Conservative values. It is a method favored by Obunga and his flock.
Hint: before posting check the fact first.
Could've been separatists thinking that it was a civilan passenger jet.
How are the thugs of Donetsk doing with that??? Did they sign onto that???
They're not firing on anybody are they or taking advantage of the cease fire to extend their positions???
And I guess they didn't fire on those jets -- they just fell out of the sky, right????
Did you not pay attention yesterday, or the day before? Or are you just being deliberately dense??
In other words, Russia started from there.
The toponym Ukraine means frontier, borderland of Rus.
Where do you get all this stuff. Do you read it from some forum in the internet or ... ?
So that's how the rebels honor a cease fire???
They must be getting their cease fire training from the terrorists in Gaza.
Quality education, good memory, and the search engines can do wonders :-)
You are confusing many things.
The Rus were a people, not confined to the modern nation state of Russia. Modern Russians and modern Ukrainians can both equally claim Rus ancestory. Neither more than the other.
Yes, Ukraine was the center of Rus civilization for several centuries. That it was not the geographical center doesn’t matter. Very few civilizations have had a geographical center.
Indeed, the name Ukraine, as it is now applied, likely came into common usage during the period of Polish control, and its reference to the area as “a border” was in reference to the border of their control. Not as you imply, that somehow it was always considered a border possession of the Russian people.
If the name Ukraine came into usage during Polish control, today's name for that country would be Pograniczie. (Pograniczie - borderland in Polish)
Polish control of Ukraine was the control of Russian borderland, not vice versa.
Toponyms are tough cookie - they can not be stolen and destroyed to fit anyone's agenda. Even altered they are telling the story right. Toponyms are the original memes.
I don't concur, and neither do others. Don't know where you are getting your information, but ultimately it doesn't matter.
It could be called the land of the unfrozen southern Rus, and it wouldn't matter in regard to their current claims on sovereignty a bit. No more than the name Belarus does.
As co-ancestors of the Rus, Urkainians have as much claim over the areas controlled by Moscow, as Russians have over areas controlled by Kiev.
Ukraine is the real Russia. Muscovites stole their name and now are stealing their land as well.
The Russian FR group will be claiming Ukraine shot down it’s own planes just watch.
BTW why do we have a Russian FR group, this is an American site?
You prefer Russia to be running things or the United States of America to be running things?
Who is your allegiance too?
It seems pretty clear there is a group of pro Russians that are collectively flooding threads here with Russian propaganda and as many posts as possible to drown out any information or reasonable discussion on what is happening in Ukraine and regarding Russia’s involvement there. I don’t know what to suggest as I am a strong proponent for free speech but thought it needed to be said, because it is getting ridiculous and harder and harder to have a reasonable and informative discussion here on this issue. The fact they have different view points is fine but this flooding of threads with posts (with what I would classify as disinformation) is disruptive.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.