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To: metmom; All; FredZarguna
Incidentally little man, I have not even mentioned 'time dilation', so your effort to attack that strawman is quite telling. What I have posted is Dr Schroeder's explanation, which does not include what you are trying to attack. But if you would actually read the link I provided, you might even know that your strawman is foolishness ... making you something of a fool, frankly.

For lurkers, here is what Schroeder actually says in the short essay at the link I provided regarding Time, and it is almost exactly opposite to what Fred is trying to attack:

The Flexible flow of time and the stretching of space

Einstein taught the world that time is relative. That in regions of high velocity or high gravity time actually passes more slowly relative to regions of lower gravity or lower velocity. (One system relative to another, hence the name, the laws of relativity.) This is now proven fact. Time actually stretches out. Were ever you are time is normal for you because your biology is part of that local system.

That is Einstein and gravity and velocity. But there is a third aspect of the universe that changes the perception of time, Not gravity and not velocity. That is the stretching of space. The universe started as a minuscule speck, perhaps not larger that a grain of mustard and stretched out from there. Space actually stretches. The effect of the stretching of space produces the effect that when observing an event that took place far from our galaxy, as the light from that event travels through space and the sequence of events travels through space, the information is actually stretched out. (In The Science of God I give the logic in detail in simple easy to understand terms.)

Honest debate requires honest refutation, not attacking a strawman deception, as Fred has tried to do. There is another, very prominent figure who tries to lie his way through any issue, but he's called pResident. Fred is just a dud.

158 posted on 02/06/2014 10:56:14 PM PST by MHGinTN (Being deceived can be cured.)
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To: MHGinTN
So many stupid statements, I really can't be bothered correcting them all, but I'll try my best to help you.

First of all, in your previous post, you claim that the inflationary period lasts for 300,000 years. Nope, not even close. The inflationary period began around 10-36 seconds after the Singularity, and went until sometime between 10-33 and 10-32 SECONDS.

300,000 years is the length of the radiation dominated life of the universe; it has nothing to do with Inflation.

Now to dissect your thoroughly unhinged mystic:

Einstein taught the world that time is relative.

This statement is so vague it has no actual meaning.

That in regions of high velocity or high gravity time actually passes more slowly relative to regions of lower gravity or lower velocity.

This statement is mumbo-jumbo. Part of it is true, and part of it is complete nonsense. There is no such thing as a "region of high velocity" because absolute uniform motion (velocity) cannot even be detected. If you (or he) understood relativity, you would know this.

The clocks of observers in different Lorentz frames appear to run more slowly EACH according to the OTHER. The choice of reference frame is entirely immaterial, and the claim that some parts of the universe are at "high velocity" is therefore 100% baloney.

(One system relative to another, hence the name, the laws of relativity.)

This statement is nonsense. Gravitational time dilation is not relative. Your guru is quite confused.

This is now proven fact.

The part that's true, is of course, true. The parts that are nonsense, sadly, remain nonsense.

[

Let me parenthetically add that what is so confusedly described so far, contrary to what Miggie describes as my "dishonesty" is, in fact, time dilation. What follows is also "time dilation." The only difference is, the space expanding effect doesn't give rise to relativistic dilation effects, because "stretching space" doesn't do that.

]

And now on with the hilarity...

Time actually stretches out.

In the case of gravitational fields, yes. In the case of relative uniform motion, no, it doesn't. The relative times recorded by commotional observers are different, but time does not "stretch" for them. They have their own proper time. The proper time of the earth is not different from "God's point of view," or "The universe's point of view," or from Miggie's point of view, or some deranged mystic's point of view.

Were ever you are time is normal for you because your biology is part of that local system.

Absolutely laughable nonsense. [And not even proofed, to boot.] ALL of the laws of physics, including those governing things dead, and things inanimate, are affected. Biology plays no role.

But there is a third aspect of the universe that changes the perception of time, Not gravity and not velocity. That is the stretching of space.

Nope. 100% BS.

The effect of the stretching of space produces the effect that when observing an event that took place far from our galaxy, as the light from that event travels through space and the sequence of events travels through space, the information is actually stretched out.

Nope.

Variable objects with known time constants at the edge of space do not show such behavior. Near objects within our Hubble neighborhood do not show such behavior either. Objects at middle distance -- which are being observed in the distant past -- also do not show that. They beep, pulsate, turn, live and die at the same rates.

"Honest debate" requires calling crap ... crap.

This would be crap.

Your Dr. is one of the most confused simpletons in the history of pseudoscience, who fails to understand that objects seen as 14 billion light years away are being observed in the distant past as well as across great distances of space, and the kinematical and other time-varying physical properties do not show any of the effects his crackpot theory would require if time actually changed as the universe expanded. Quasars and distant galaxies are in this unexpanded period. Stars in them emit the same spectra, and live and die at the predicted rates. Not faster, not slower, not different.

Fail. You should have stuck with relativistic time dilation (and so should he) because this absolutely confused hodge-podge of relativity, semi-classical physics, and pure mysticism is nothing more than a load of 100% pure and unrefined BS. His "space stretching" claim is falsified by every observation of the universe we have.

159 posted on 02/07/2014 12:30:55 AM PST by FredZarguna (Das ist nicht nur nicht richtig, es ist nicht einmal falsch!)
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