Replies

boadbums: "I gather that it was Kevmo's use of the term "God damned heretics" that really is what has you perturbed - you have repeated it more than a dozen times."

Duh!

boadbums: "It seems you are unable to separate the views of the founders of America WRT religion versus politics.
That some held religious doctrines that were NOT orthodox, isn't a reason to toss out everything ELSE they believed..."

Please, please don't forget the essential fact here: spirited irish titled her thread, in part: "Damnable Heresies", and Kevmo has determined that my views, similar to those of many Founders, make me a "God Damned Heretic".

Now, it seems to me that should be a matter of grave concern to "the community at large", that both Kevmo and spirited should be sternly scolded for not only intemperate language, but unacceptable ideology.
Has anything like that happened?
Not a hint of it.
Instead, yours truly, BroJoeK, has been roundly scolded by boatbums & others for merely objecting to such insane talk.

Why?

boadbums: "NOBODY is advocating the murder of them or those who believe as some of them might have.
To be honest, I think you are being a little hysterical over it."

But, of course, you're not honest, because, if you were, then you'd have something to say -- here, on this thread -- to Kevmo about his "hysterical" words calling BroJoeK (and by implication, our Founders), a "God Damned Heretic".
And spiritually speaking, what could be more murderous in intent than calling down God's damnation on somebody who disagrees with your religious doctrines?

boadbums: "I repeat, they were not founders of a religion but of a nation and the basic underpinnings through their writings for how a nation can function in the best possible way for all its citizens."

True enough, but I again ask you to please remember: this thread is for the purpose of discussing "Damnable Heresies", and Kevmo has identified yours truly, BroJoeK, (and by implication our Founders) as one of those "God Damned Heretics".

But no, their hysteria is of no concern to boatbums.
Boatbums has nothing to say about their utter freekin insanity -- zero, zip, nada.
Instead boatbums is oh, so very worried about BroJoeK's reminders of how lunatic those people are.

So boatbums wants to be on their side, while still pretending to be half-way sane yourself, don't you?

boadbums: "You ask if I want to take "both sides".
I don't see that there really are two opposing sides.
Kevmo correctly states that God will damn those who do not believe the truth.
Jesus said we would "die in our sins" if we believed not that he was who he claimed to be.
What you call "murderous hatred" is pointless hyperbole - nobody is advocating an inquisition.
Cool your jets."

Ah, but FRiend, they do -- at least here on Free Republic.
Look at the language Kevmo uses not just to me but others who disagree with him.
He clearly wished to drive us off of Free Republic, and if he could get the "powers that be" to support him, he'd zot is in a second, wouldn't he?
In that sense, his intentions are not just spiritually but also physically murderous.

As for who "denies the truth", I'll again remind you that nobody on this particular thread has denied a single word the New Testament says about Jesus.
Yes, I have presented a small-few different interpretations of some words, interpretations which support many of our Founders' religious ideas, plus those of more-or-less 50 million world-wide "restorationists" non-Trinitarian Christians today.
And I have not asked anybody to accept those views, only that they be treated with forbearance & respect on Free Republic -- since nearly all those 50 million "restorationist" Christians should be our natural political allies.

FRiend boatbums, do you not yet grasp what's going on here?

BJK: Please, please don’t forget the essential fact here: spirited irish titled her thread, in part: “Damnable Heresies”, and Kevmo has determined that my views, similar to those of many Founders, make me a “God Damned Heretic”.
Now, it seems to me that should be a matter of grave concern to “the community at large”, that both Kevmo and spirited should be sternly scolded for not only intemperate language, but unacceptable ideology.

Spirited: The concern you raise is of grave concern to all human beings who view themselves as “sovereign,” that is, there is no transcendent Authority, no Mind, over their own minds. In other words, “man, but particularly BJK in this instance, is the measure of all things.”

That sinful men would elevate their corrupted reasoning above God was one of the very grave concerns of perceptive thinkers like Richard Weaver.

By the close of WW II, Weaver and countless other classical liberals apprehensively discerned that the Western civilized nations were on the road to breakdown and

totalitarianism.

Suffering “progressive disillusionment,” Weaver perceived that old cultural restraints had failed to control man’s propensity for evil. This led him to ponder the fallacies of modernist ideas-—the ones you champion, BRK-—
that had produced the holocaust of evil visited upon the world from WW I to WW II.

By late 1945, Weaver published his conclusions in his book, “Ideas Have Consequences.” The subject of Weaver’s book was “the dissolution of the West.” Its deterioration was traced by Weaver to the late 14th century when Western man had made an “evil decision.” Enticed by William of Occam’s (d. c. 1349) philosophy of nominalism, Western man abandoned his belief in eternally unchanging transcendent “universals” and thus the position that “there is a source of truth higher than, and independent of, man...”

The consequences of this revolution in ideas were catastrophic, for “The denial of everything transcending experience means inevitably...the denial of truth. With the denial of objective truth there is no escape from the relativism of ‘man is the measure of all things.”

As Weaver feared, things worsened as the downward spiral continued:

God would be conceptually murdered, Heaven shut-down and Nature itself elevated to the supreme reality. The doctrine of original sin was abandoned and replaced by the “goodness of man.” With only the physical world of the senses held to be real, supernatural Christianity declined, rationalism arose, and materialist science and biological evolution became the most prestigious way to study man.

With knowledge limited to the sensory realm (empiricism), man’s spiritual attributes, that is, man’s soul, mind,
conscience, and free will were soon lost in an endless cycle of reductionism and determinism. Man, created in the spiritual likeness of his supernatural Creator would be lost. In his place would stand the soulless human ape, an accidental emergent product of mindless evolutionary forces.

Weaver dubbed this way of thinking the “spoiled-child psychology” of modern man, who had “not been made to see the relationship between reward and effort.”

This orgy of mindlessness is traceable to certain terrible-willed modernists who, no longer wanting to be created in the spiritual likeness of their Creator, had failed to achieve an integrated world picture, a “metaphysical dream,” said Weaver.

Weaver concluded with an ominous warning:

“the closer man stands to ruin, the duller grows his realization (for) the annihilation of spiritual being precedes the destruction of temple walls.” (The Conservative Intellectual Movement in America, George H. Nash, pp. 30-33)

There it is BRK, a portrait of yourself: the spoiled-child psychology of a terrible-willed relativist blind to the fact that the cost of his intellectual arrogance is
annihilation of spiritual being.

But then pride goes before the fall of the narcissist relentlessly pursuing “self-gratification” no matter the cost to others. If erasing the stain of heresy from “self” means destroying the good character of others, then so be it.

Only in this world are you able to get away with your chicanery, manipulation of perception, and endless quibbling over the meaning of heresy. But within minutes of the death of your body, your immortal soul will be met by either a righteous angel or an evil angel sent to escort you into eternity.

With every lie, deception, twisted meaning, attempt at manipulation of perception and transference of your own guilt onto others, you are freely choosing which angel will be waiting for you when your immortal soul departs your dead body. And this is why CS Lewis said hell is a freely made choice.

It is not too late for you to repent, BRK. But don’t wait until it’s too late.

boadbums: “I gather that it was Kevmo’s use of the term “God damned heretics” that really is what has you perturbed - you have repeated it more than a dozen times.”

brojoke: Duh!
***What did you expect when you log onto a thread with a partial title “Damnable Heresy” and start spreading heretical views? That we would pin some kind of award on your chest?

Please, please don’t forget the essential fact here: spirited irish titled her thread, in part: “Damnable Heresies”, and Kevmo has determined that my views...make me a “God Damned Heretic”., similar to those of many Founders, ***Yes, they do. And others on this thread have concurred.

Now, it seems to me that should be a matter of grave concern to “the community at large”, that both Kevmo and spirited should be sternly scolded for not only intemperate language, but unacceptable ideology.
***You would no doubt “sternly scold” Christ Himself for holding exactly the same idealogy. When Jesus damns false teachers as yourself, He calls them sons of satan. That’s more intemperate than what I’ve been calling you, a simple heretic. If my idealogy is unacceptable then so is that of Jesus Himself and 95% of Christendom as well.

Ah, but FRiend,
***Ah, but Heretic, we do not. If someone were to call for an inquisition then you’d have some ground to stand on. But no one has, so you’re stuck making your typical arguments by extension.

they do — at least here on Free Republic.
Look at the language Kevmo uses not just to me but others who disagree with him.
***Look at the language that Jesus uses with those He disagrees with: He calls you ‘vipers’ and ‘sons of satan’. If Jesus were a FReeper, you’d be crying for His zot right now.

He clearly wished
***Significantly, such mind reading is not allowed on Religion threads and in my little experiment there were about a dozen comments such as yours which were promptly removed by the religion mod when she was informed of them. Your crap would not be allowed on such threads, which is why we don’t see you operating on them.

to drive us off of Free Republic, and if he could get the “powers that be” to support him, he’d zot is in a second, wouldn’t he?
***My efforts at getting the ‘scientism’ tag recognized by the religion moderator are proof that you’re wrong, yet again, you despicable heretic troll.

In that sense, his intentions
***You wouldn’t be allowed to say that kind of crap on religion threads, which is why you don’t go onto them, your intention is to push heresy onto FReepers, and to be against your efforts is a noble cause indeed.

are not just spiritually but also physically murderous.
***Physically murderous, what a load of crap. You are rightfully labelled “hysterical” by boatbums, and so that makes you a Hysterical Heretic. You’re a God damned, Hideous Hysterical Heretic.

As for who “denies the truth”, I’ll again remind you that nobody on this particular thread has denied a single word the New Testament says about Jesus.
***Your idealogy pushes you to have to “interpret” plain language texts in a ridiculous and heretical fashion. It is a denial of truth.

Yes, I have presented a small-few different interpretations of some words, interpretations which
***Interpretations which are heretical

support many of our Founders’ religious ideas, plus those of more-or-less 50 million world-wide “restorationists”
***Beautiful euphemism for heretics.

non-Trinitarian Christians today.
***Heretics

And I have not asked anybody to accept those views, only that they be treated with forbearance & respect on Free Republic
***Why should FR treat heresy with forebearance & respect?

— since nearly all those 50 million “restorationist”
***Heretical

Christians should be our natural political allies.
***Yup, that’s exactly the same kind of reasoning we saw on the mormonism threads when Romnuts got the nomination. Heresy is so appealing when it’s your political ally.

FRiend boatbums, do you not yet grasp what’s going on here?
***Heretic Brojoke, what is going on here is that you are pushing a damnable heresy. You are properly called a God damned heretic.

All I grasp of what is going on here is YOU, getting your knickers in a knot because someone expressed an opinion - something EVERYONE here has just as much right to as you do. You apparently believe that doctrine doesn't or shouldn't matter to a Christian and you would be absolutely WRONG to think that. All you have to do is look at how God dealt with it to know that it IS highly critical to following God in a correct way and according to how HE wants us to. This isn't to say that we shouldn't respect others and to treat others as we would want to be treated, but when someone promotes ideas that fly in the face of the truth, they SHOULD be corrected. Those who refuse correction, should be noted. We are told to have no fellowship with the "unfruitful works of darkness". The Apostle John had this to say:

Anyone who goes too far and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house, and do not give him a greeting; for the one who gives him a greeting participates in his evil deeds. (I John 1:9-11)

Nobody says you should be murdered - THAT is being hysterical.