We never had a major disagreement and most as far as I remember we have generally agree, so I will ask you this question and except your answer.
Right or wrongly you confront trespassers on your property they refuse to leave and appear they have had plenty to drink. One of the group grabs a rock and starts towards you a second member of the party grabs your arm. Do you shoot?
I say if the Crocker had not been arm we would likely be read a story about a property own who confronted some trans passers and got his head bashed in for his trouble
I have been around a lot in my life, I have taken guns and knives from people and been around a lot of violence and rough people in my life, I cringe when I hear of a case of what I see as wimps with guns, who kill because they are just the kind of people who shouldn't own guns because they are badly constructed mentally and emotionally. I think most of us know people who can own a gun, but that we know shouldn't, the kind of people who always want to lay down the law to others.
I have lived around water for much of my life, and I can't see a situation where I shoot the rafters down on the river. I don't think that I would have had to kill anyone that day, even if I they didn't kowtow enough to me while using their river.
Sometimes the shooter is wrong, even if he beats the rap legally, that is what I was trying to say in post 52.
Post 132 does a good job of showing a place where some middle class rafters stopping to pee and take a break, didn't need to be dealing with shots in the air, in the ground, and to die at the hands of an unstable man.
""'You are on private property, but you have a right to be there if it's a navigable stream and as long as you are on a gravel bar that is submerged during parts of the year, because it's part of the stream bed.'
He added, that despite the confusion: 'It obviously doesn't have anything to do with people shooting people. We don't have a stand-your-gravel-bar law yet.'""
That’s true Kart. However, according to the story, the landowner shot at them before they picked up rocks and came toward him. That can be seen as premeditated assault, and will I think, have an impact on the case.
Had they actually thrown rocks and hit him before he shot, that would be a stronger case for him. This is complicated further by the uncertainty over whether they were on his property when he fired at them, or were they still on the easement?
It’s stupidity for the floaters to have stayed there, but it’s not a clear cut case of self defense for either party. Might wind up with involuntary manslaughter for the landowner though.
He wasn’t injured, and juries don’t like dead bodies over things like stealing watermelons or taking a leak. Now if you get 12 people who own property on a canoe stream.....