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To: 11th Commandment

I think the word games about National Socialism being a left of center party because it had the word Socialism in the title is not a winning argument for our side.

Now certainly it is not easy to map the German political spectrum of 1933 onto a the US body politic, indeed to do so in any sense is ludicrous, but Hitler’s hatred of the Communists and Socialists in Germany was absolute, and he specifically chose the title National Socialists in order to be misleading about his political agenda with the lower classes in Germany who were favorably disposed to the Socialist ideas. If the Socialists and Communiste were “Left”, then the Nazis were decidedly Right, and bonded themselves tightly with corporate and military interests, as was classic to the political Right in that time and place.


11 posted on 04/09/2013 8:28:39 AM PDT by babble-on
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To: babble-on
The Nazis were left-wing.

They were National Socialists, the same way that the Communists were International Socialists. There was very little difference between the two. Hitler even used the Bolshevik symbol - the Swastika.

The only theoretical difference was that Hitler wanted to control the means of production: whereas the Communists wanted to own the means of production.

Both Fascism and Communism were totalitarian oligarchies - indistinguishable to the people trapped under their jackboots.

They were natural allies ( for instance: cooperating on the division of Poland) - right up to the moment Hitler was stymied in the West and needed to get his hands on some more 'means of production' - and launched Operation Barbarossa.

Fighting the Left doesn't make you Right-wing. In many cases it just means you're fighting over the spoils or getting rid of a rival.

Was Stalin right-wing because he had Trotsky killed?

Was Hitler right-wing because he had Röhm killed?

Were the Bolsheviks right-wing because they wiped out the Mensheviks?

Hope this is helpful.

17 posted on 04/09/2013 8:52:06 AM PDT by agere_contra (I once saw a movie where only the police and military had guns. It was called 'Schindler's List'.)
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To: babble-on
I think the word games about National Socialism being a left of center party because it had the word Socialism in the title is not a winning argument for our side.

It's absolutely not just word games.

You're right that it's not easy to map German politics of the time onto ours, but why is it done then? It's because the left is trying its best to draw parallels between the European Right and classical American liberalism on the basis of some flimsy pretext of being "pro-business".

Which is as mendacious as it is asinine.

BOTH European left and right are virulently statist philosophies. Even the European "center" can be described as just moderate statism. What we call American "conservatism" or "classical liberalism" doesn't even fit into the European left-right framework....it is completely off that scale.

If we were smart we wouldn't adopt the enemy's idiotic language and call ourselves a "rightist" movement at all. And I think we absolutely need to point out that whether it's the left boot on your neck or the right one doesn't make a damn bit of difference in the end.

20 posted on 04/09/2013 9:09:58 AM PDT by Claud
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To: babble-on
Hitler's philosophy included the following:

Absolute subservience of the interests of the individual to the state and the masses (volk).

Individuals and especially children are the property of the state.

Contempt for democracy in any of its forms.

Workers and labor (Proletariat), through the National Socialist German Workers' Party, were in theory in charge of the means of production. In practice and for practical reasons private management of industry continued but strictly under the direction and with the consent of the Party and its Fuehrer (Leader). "Capital" meant "Jews". "Patriotic" and ethnically pure Aryan capitalists were allowed to exist and even thrived under Nazism but more as a convenience than because Hitler believed in a free market economy.

An armed citizenry? Ganz verboten!

Anyone who evidenced disagreement with this philosophy were silenced on pain of imprisonment and frequently death.

"Right" and "Left" are labels which are routinely and intentionally (or more often ignorantly) misused. Everything about Nazism reeks of anti-Capitalism, anti-Individual Liberty, anti-Christianity, pro-Statism, and pro violent revolution against the Western European and Enlightenment Judeo-Christian ethos. It therefore is also a fair mirror image of today's U.S. Democratic Party and its leadership and philosophy.

24 posted on 04/09/2013 9:38:02 AM PDT by katana (Just my opinions)
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To: babble-on
I think the word games about National Socialism being a left of center party because it had the word Socialism in the title is not a winning argument for our side.

On the contrary, I think our side MUST make the distinction.

The left in the US is constantly trying to paint us with the "right wing NAZI" brush.

It's essential to expose the truth that Hitler WAS socialist and leaned WAY left compared to what is considered conservatism here.

He was an authoritarian, statist dictator as far from conservatism as you can get.

31 posted on 04/09/2013 10:55:41 AM PDT by what's up
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