Carney: It's a penalty, not a tax

upi.com ^ | 6/30/12 | UPI

[ColdOne]

"It's a penalty because you have a choice," Carney said. "You don't have a choice to pay your taxes, right? You have a choice to buy -- if you can afford health insurance. … So if you don't buy it, and you can afford it, it is an irresponsible thing to do to ask the rest of America's taxpayers to pay for your care when you go to the emergency room. So your choice is to purchase healthcare reform or a penalty will be administered."

[WKB]

Why is in Obamacars to hire 16000 new people at the IRS if nobody knew it was a tax.

[dragnet2]

It's a penalty, it's a plan, an insurance fee, it's a toll, it's a tax, it's a levy, an assessment, an obligation, a fine, it's a tariff, a commission, an expense, an imposition..

It's enough to make ya blap in their grey poupon jar.

[Gabrial]

My friend has his own electrical contracting firm and he puts $300 every month into a special account for his health care. It has always covered his health care.

Now the government will take his money for those that don't provide for themselves.

He thinks Carney and Obama can go to hell.

[The Great RJ]

By the same tortured reasoning in the SCOTUS decision on Obamacare one could easily deem a shovel to be a chair.

[MinuteGal]

"Carney: It's a Penalty, Not a Tax"

Too bad it's the wrong Carney. Art Carney would have been a smarter, more honest and wittier press secretary .

Ed Norton: "If manhole covers were pizzas, the sewers would be Paradise."

Leni

[ex-snook]

So whatever else it is, it’s the law now. So after the moaning in over maybe the GOP could provide legislation for Romney’s revisions and start moving the ball.

[oldbrowser]

A tax “is not a voluntary payment or donation, but an enforced contribution, exacted pursuant to legislative authority” and is “any contribution imposed by government [...] whether under the name of toll, tribute, tallage, gabel, impost, duty, custom, excise, subsidy, aid, supply, or other name...Bucks law dictionary.

[tophat9000]

Your correct.. the government has now been given official sanction that the power to tax is not just to raise revenues to run the government

It is now official sanction and permissible to use the governments power to tax and government taxing agencies to harasses, coercive, punish and destroy a citizens for any reason they see fit

Consider the harassment of the Tea party groups by the IRS

Consider Obama's statement about coal power plans..We will not stop you from builder them...but we will tax you out of existence..

The left, when in power, uses the power to tax as a weapon

It is with some irony that the original American revolution was keyed by Parliament using taxes as a coercive force and punishment on the American colonies

Again I say a new Constitution Amendment is a must now.... stated that the power granted to tax may NOT BE USE AS A coercive force on the people

[glowworm]

'So whatever else it is, it’s the law now. So after the moaning in over maybe the GOP could provide legislation for Romney’s revisions and start moving the ball.'

Actually, it was the law the minute Obomba signed it. It was simply not rescinded, though challenged, through the supreme kangaroo court as it certainly souldav been.

[samtheman]

They are taking this position, still, because they know that if it is a tax, it will have to be re-authorized in the House - something that will not happen. If this isn’t enough for them, then consider that a now-tax bill ORIGINATED in the Senate where taxes are not supposed to orginate, and you have a conundrum for Obama....good!

I'm telling ya'... I'm starting to believe the "evil genius" talk about Roberts...

[Brilliant]

Then it’s unconstitutional. We need a rehearing.

[Sir Napsalot]

>>> Carney is right.

No Siree Bud. Carney is a clown.

Mandate is not a choice. You can’t have both.

[Marie]

Actually(and I can’t find the source right now - I’ll get it to you tomorrow if you like) I believe that the $1 abortion surcharge is an opt-out thing.

You can opt-out if you don’t want to pay it.

I will be opting out!

[TornadoAlley3]

Geesh, the resolution calls it a living document..

S.RES.376 — Whereas the American Revolution secured the independence of the United States of America and made possible the vibrant system of self-government of the United States; (Introduced in Senate - IS)

SRES 376 IS

112th CONGRESS

2d Session

S. RES. 376

Commemorating the 225th anniversary of the signing of the Constitution of the United States and recognizing the contributions of the National Society of the Sons of the American Revolution and the National Society Daughters of the American Revolution.

IN THE SENATE OF THE UNITED STATES

February 15, 2012

Mr. WICKER submitted the following resolution; which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary

---

RESOLUTION

Commemorating the 225th anniversary of the signing of the Constitution of the United States and recognizing the contributions of the National Society of the Sons of the American Revolution and the National Society Daughters of the American Revolution.

Whereas the American Revolution secured the independence of the United States of America and made possible the vibrant system of self-government of the United States;

Whereas the supporters of the American Revolution, through their vision and determination, enhanced the lives of countless individuals and made possible the system of equal justice, limited government, and the rule of law that exists in the United States;

Whereas the people who fought in the American Revolution made great sacrifices for their fledgling country;

Whereas the 55 delegates who attended the Constitutional Convention in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, 225 years ago, and the 39 delegates who signed the Constitution of the United States at the Constitutional Convention, irrevocably changed the course of history;

Whereas the Constitution of the United States, a revered and living document—

(1) provides important rights to every citizen of the United States;

(2) secures `the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity’; and

(3) sets the standard of democracy for the world;

Whereas the delegates to the Constitutional Convention in 1787 established the imperative precedent of compromise;

Whereas the Constitution and the subsequent 27 amendments to the Constitution outline the freedoms and the principles of representative government that are as strong today as they were on that momentous occasion in 1787;

Whereas September 17, 2012, marks the 225th anniversary of the signing of the Constitution of the United States, which is the supreme law of the land and the document by which the people of the United States govern their great country;

Whereas, to venerate the immeasurable importance of the Constitution and the day on which the Constitution was signed, it is essential to continually educate people about, and celebrate, the principles and legacy of the Founding Fathers; and

Whereas members of organizations such as the National Society of the Sons of the American Revolution and the National Society Daughters of the American Revolution play an important role in promoting patriotism, preserving the history of the United States, and educating the public about the rights and responsibilities of citizenship: Now, therefore, be it

Resolved, That the Senate—
(1) commemorates the 225th anniversary of the signing of the Constitution of the United States on September 17, 2012, and remembers the sacrifices made by the people who made the signing possible; and
(2) applauds the continuing contributions made by the members, volunteers, and staff of historical, educational, and patriotic societies of the United States, such as the National Society of the Sons of the American Revolution and the National Society Daughters of the American Revolution, in promoting patriotism and the values embodied in the Constitution of the United States.

[a fool in paradise]

"It's a penalty because you have a choice," Carney said. "You don't have a choice to pay your taxes, right? You have a choice to buy -- if you can afford health insurance. … So if you don't buy it, and you can afford it, it is an irresponsible thing to do to ask the rest of America's taxpayers to pay for your care when you go to the emergency room. So your choice is to purchase healthcare reform or a penalty will be administered."

BULLSTALIN

If you REALLY felt that way, you would prohibit illegal aliens from sneaking across the border and then having the US taxpayer pay for the medical costs of delivering their "anchor babies".

[Meet the New Boss]

You’re right: a “mandate is not a choice.”

A mandate is an order from the government to do something, in this case to purchase health insurance.

Because it is a command or mandate to take an action (like “you must obey the posted speed limit, or pay a penalty”), it is NOT a tax.

Roberts is wrong.

And as I just explained here, not only is Roberts wrong about it being a tax, but the new Roberts Tax he announced is not even itself constitutional.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/bloggers/2901385/posts?page=28#28

In terms of quality of legal analysis, the Roberts Tax opinion is one of the worst Supreme Court opinions in history.

[Fledermaus]

No Carney, you idiot, in my opinion is you don’t have insurance and can afford it then you pay the bill yourself. To hell with you if you have to sell your house or go bankrupt. Fool.

I can solve this problem with ease: no insurance, no medical treatment. You can’t pretend it would be immoral to do so and then whine about the cost.

[Iron Munro]

Carney should find out what fortress Chief Justice Roberts is hiding in, go over there and get him straightened out.

[philman_36]

“The excise tax would be assessed through the tax code and applied as an additional amount of Federal tax owed.”

@ Sec. 9001\4980I IRC (page 793)

TITLE IX—REVENUE PROVISIONS
Subtitle A—Revenue Offset Provisions

SEC. 9001. EXCISE TAX ON HIGH COST EMPLOYER-SPONSORED HEALTH COVERAGE.

(a) IN GENERAL.—Chapter 43 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986, as amended by section 1513, is amended by adding at the end the following:

‘‘SEC. 4980I. EXCISE TAX ON HIGH COST EMPLOYER-SPONSORED HEALTH COVERAGE.

‘‘(a) IMPOSITION OF TAX.—If— ‘‘(1) an employee is covered under any applicable employer sponsored coverage of an employer at any time during a taxable period, and
‘‘(2) there is any excess benefit with respect to the coverage, there is hereby imposed a tax equal to 40 percent of the excess benefit.

It's a tax and it was known all along that it was a tax.

[funfan]

They always new it was a tax and in 2010 they said as much. I feel like the fix has been in all along and Roberts new how he would rule all along.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/18/health/policy/18health.html?_r=1