Posted on 11/10/2011 12:35:57 PM PST by Johnny B.
According to a slide presentation given by NASA engineer Michael A. Nelson, which New Energy Times obtained under a FOIA request, “Energy Catalyzer” inventor Andrea Rossi failed to conclusively show that his device produced excess heat from a nuclear energy source.
According to Nelson, a NASA engineer who investigates low-energy nuclear reactions and space applications, Rossi did not run his demonstration long enough to prove his extraordinary claim.
At the Sept. 22, 2011 LENR Workshop at NASA Glenn Research Center, Nelson explained that Rossi “would need to run [his experiment] for eight hours or more with a small E-Cat and much longer for an Ottoman [Fat-Cat] to rule out a chemical reaction.”
According to Nelson, it would take “three or more days for a small E-Cat, two or more weeks for an Ottoman [Fat-Cat] E-Cat and several months for a 1 MW plant.”
Brian Ahern, a researcher with expertise in LENR, wrote to New Energy Times with a concise summary of the recent Oct. 28 Rossi demo:
“Rossi has been clever enough to change the trick on each successive demo. Using a secret customer is a great way to allow him to fulfill his promise to demo the 1 MW unit in October. He then evaded conducting the demo transparently by saying that the customer demanded the demo conditions. The “customer’ signed off when Rossi gave him the wink and he shut things down without any measurements by anyone except the shill.
“Occam’s Razor, on the other hand, says that 12 inconclusive demos in succession are not random. It is well planned and orchestrated. He has used the journalists like a team of puppets.”
I haven't seen any sold yet. Have you?
You were talking about nickel. Nickel isn't fissile material.
and you get that sucker cooking and it'll provide enough really hot protons
Hot protons? That's funny.
Not sure you get a radioactive isotope of nickel, but when you break up a nickel atom you're sure to get something besides nickel.
I thought Rossi discovered fusion, not fission?
That was a response to a question.
Somebody else focused primarily on nickel and said "Hey, bro, no reaction with nickel so no fusion" ~ but that wasn't my part of the discussion.
The deal with nickel is "tunneling" and a resultant fusion of a proton with a nucleus with the consequent release of a great deal of energy (but a lot short of what you get screwing around with U238 or plutonium.)
I don't think anyone but High Energy Physics aficionados are demanding that Low Energy Physics show the results of High Energy Physics.
Still, isn't that interesting that Nickel, with 5 stable isotopes actually has 1 stable isotope that can be turned into iron.
Definitely need to follow up on that one to see what it's really about because that certainly puts the sword to a common understanding of "stable".
Bet Dr. Focardi can tell us what that's about ~
If fusion of elements heavier than iron released energy, it would occur in the cores of stars. Stars would contain more and more of these heavier elements the older they were. Stars would never run out of fuel.
Still, isn't that interesting that Nickel, with 5 stable isotopes actually has 1 stable isotope that can be turned into iron.
Not that interesting. "with a half-life over 700×1018 years"
So, apparently, it happens ~ just not in the core. Try: http://iris.lib.neu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1010&context=physics_fac_pubs&sei-redir=1&referer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2Furl%3Fsa%3Dt%26rct%3Dj%26q%3Dwidom%2520and%2520larsen%2520high%2520energy%2520particles%2520in%2520the%2520solar%2520corona%26source%3Dweb%26cd%3D12%26ved%3D0CB8QFjABOAo%26url%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Firis.lib.neu.edu%252Fcgi%252Fviewcontent.cgi%253Farticle%253D1010%2526context%253Dphysics_fac_pubs%26ei%3DREm9TuPoIeXW2AW4-sXLBQ%26usg%3DAFQjCNHvu-8AffltUWIkZX2MTFVZ02zcZw#search=%22widom%20larsen%20high%20energy%20particles%20solar%20corona%22
I'm talking about an industrial scale unit capable of putting out 5000 watts. I seriously doubt that your inductive cooktop was capable of that level of output. Your pot isn't remotely as big as the ecat, nor was room temperature water flowing through it, which kind of ups the power requirement over your cooktop. Unfortunately, it is "you" who doesn't know what he's talking about. I've used these units. I know exactly how big they are.
Thanks for the link. Nickel would still be endothermic.
“I know exactly how big they are.”
No, apparently you don’t:
This is an example of a cheap inductive range putting out 3000 watts. Now, why don’t you go ahead and tell us again why your 5000 watt unit is so much bigger and fancier than this?
Keep in mind that Rossi’s unit doesn’t even boil water! He recently described it as only heating the water, rather than boiling it.
LOL....because it's older. Looks like high-power electronics have shrunk more than I thought over the years since I worked with them.
Of course, that still doesn't get around the fact of the 1/R2 problem, or that you can detect RF with basically a coat hanger and meter. And I'd bet that the Italian physicists at the first demo checked for RF. Probably not mentioned in the written report, but there was a video interview with one of them, and he was kind of snickering about the "portable instrumentation" they had sneaked in.
"Keep in mind that Rossi’s unit doesn’t even boil water! He recently described it as only heating the water, rather than boiling it.
Well, in the 18 hour "no-steam" experiment, it "did" only "heat water". Depends on the flow rate.
If you can’t show me in the written test report where they tested for this, then it didn’t happen.
I’m sure they didn’t test for this.
One Word: "Solyndra"
Sure, and if Rossi’s units produced an endless supply of ham sandwiches, NYC could eat for free. Unfortunately, E-Cats produce neither steam nor ham sandwiches...
You're sure about a lot of things. The problem with your certainty is that induction heating is one of the "obvious fakes" for this kind of rig. Anybody with a "skeptic" background (and certainly any scientist) would immediately think of it.
And, in your opinion, verbal evidence from a videotape isn't valid?? The law disagrees with you.
I’m sorry, is this a courtroom, or a scientific experiment? It looks like a courtroom, all right: a kangaroo court, with Judge Rossi presiding.
Hydrogen peroxide is an obvious fake as well, and nobody’s tested for that, either—because Rossi won’t let them.
Go ahead and post for us the chemical assay results for the inputs to the experiment, along with some of the many tests that skeptics have suggested. You won’t, because you can’t—Rossi hasn’t allowed these tests to be performed.
The wheels are going to come off Rossi’s scambus fairly soon. So far, he hasn’t failed to disappoint amused skeptics with his antics, and now we hear that he’s selling shares in his invention? WOW, WHAT A SHOCK.
“Anybody with a “skeptic” background (and certainly any scientist) would immediately think of it.”
Can we accept that as your indictment of Jed’s article? Remember, Jed says that he had listed EVERY possible way of getting energy into the Rossi experiment, but somehow forgot magnetic induction...
A bit of both, actually.
"Hydrogen peroxide is an obvious fake as well, and nobody’s tested for that, either—because Rossi won’t let them."
Ruled out by the 18 hour no-steam test. No chemical analysis needed. See Fletcher's writeup:
http://lenr.qumbu.com/rossi_ecat_proof_v401.pdf
More commentary on the above:
http://nextbigfuture.com/2011/06/alan-fletcher-write-up-of-how-to-prove.html
"You won’t, because you can’t—Rossi hasn’t allowed these tests to be performed."
Incorrect. In the 6 Ocbober tests, participants had full access to the drain line. If they failed to take samples, it isn't because "Rossi hasn't allowed.....".
But "you're sure".......
Which article? Jed's posted a lot of stuff.
I never said they would; I think it’s an enormous scam or Rossi has deluded himself regarding what he sees.
I thought I’d made that point pretty clear.
My point was that generating electricity isn’t the only thing you can do with steam.
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