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Safe nuclear does exist, and China is leading the way with thorium
The Telegraph ^ | 3/20/2011 | Ambrose Evans-Pritchard

Posted on 03/20/2011 8:25:08 PM PDT by bruinbirdman

A few weeks before the tsunami struck Fukushima’s uranium reactors and shattered public faith in nuclear power, China revealed that it was launching a rival technology to build a safer, cleaner, and ultimately cheaper network of reactors based on thorium.

This passed unnoticed –except by a small of band of thorium enthusiasts – but it may mark the passage of strategic leadership in energy policy from an inert and status-quo West to a rising technological power willing to break the mould.

If China’s dash for thorium power succeeds, it will vastly alter the global energy landscape and may avert a calamitous conflict over resources as Asia’s industrial revolutions clash head-on with the West’s entrenched consumption.

China’s Academy of Sciences said it had chosen a “thorium-based molten salt reactor system”. The liquid fuel idea was pioneered by US physicists at Oak Ridge National Lab in the 1960s, but the US has long since dropped the ball. Further evidence of Barack `Obama’s “Sputnik moment”, you could say.

Chinese scientists claim that hazardous waste will be a thousand times less than with uranium. The system is inherently less prone to disaster.

“The reactor has an amazing safety feature,” said Kirk Sorensen, a former NASA engineer at Teledyne Brown and a thorium expert.

“If it begins to overheat, a little plug melts and the salts drain into a pan. There is no need for computers, or the sort of electrical pumps that were crippled by the tsunami. The reactor saves itself,” he said.

“They operate at atmospheric pressure so you don’t have the sort of hydrogen explosions we’ve seen in Japan. One of these reactors would have come through the tsunami just fine. There would have been no radiation release.”

Thorium is a silvery metal named after the Norse god

(Excerpt) Read more at telegraph.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: china; chinasyndrome2; energy; fission; helium3; japan; thorium
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To: volunbeer
" it is hard for me to believe that something that seems so promising would have been ignored for this long"

yitbos

21 posted on 03/20/2011 9:15:07 PM PDT by bruinbirdman ("Those who control language control minds." -- Ayn Rand)
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To: volunbeer

Pebble Beds are still out there. It’s just that nobody is bulding them. . .


22 posted on 03/20/2011 9:42:08 PM PDT by Salgak (Acme Lasers presents: The Energizer Border: I dare you to try and cross it. . .)
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To: bruinbirdman

What do they use on a submarine?


23 posted on 03/20/2011 9:59:41 PM PDT by Lurkina.n.Learnin (Figures don't lie, liars figure!)
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To: bruinbirdman

Count me among the “thorium enthusiasts”...encouraging to see it’s being adopted elsewhere at least, if not here.


24 posted on 03/20/2011 10:15:08 PM PDT by Ackackadack
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To: volunbeer

It’s not big companies, per se, it is the weaponizable by-product that won out in the 50’s. If research monies are minimal, you get minimal results.

We’d never have gotten to the moon without a orchestrated effort backed by proper funding.


25 posted on 03/20/2011 10:39:58 PM PDT by Puckster
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To: volunbeer

The Indian advanced heavy-water reactor is going beyond the research stage. Their prototype unit is supposed to go online sometime in 2012 according to this article (http://www.globalenergymagazine.com/?p=2968). Also, it’s not a fast breeder reactor design; it uses thermal neutrons. I hope they can pull it off.

I liked the molten salt breeder reactor design that also uses Thorium. It was tried out experimentally in the US a couple of decades ago. However there are substantial engineering challenges to develop materials that can last long term in molten fluorine salts and to develop on-site fuel reprocessing to facilitate radioactive byproduct extraction. Continued development was killed for lack of funding.


26 posted on 03/20/2011 10:45:48 PM PDT by tony549 (Stuck in SoCal)
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To: Thud

“safe” and “Chinese”

Yet another oxymoron.

I China it’s considered “population control”.


27 posted on 03/20/2011 10:51:56 PM PDT by Puckster
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To: tony549

Thanks. That does sound promising and I really hope it works as designed. It would be nice to see some of the money we have poured into alternative energies go towards better nuclear energy but most of that energy has been directed towards political goals vs reality. Nuclear obviously seems to be the answer but it was “silent screamed” long ago.

I thought we were about to turn the corner on nuclear energy but the hysterical reporting from Japan has once again set us back.


28 posted on 03/20/2011 11:10:27 PM PDT by volunbeer
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To: Wooly

More people have died in the backseat of Ted Kennedy’s car than any nuclear power plant on US soil.


29 posted on 03/20/2011 11:21:47 PM PDT by preacher (A government which robs from Peter to pay Paul will always have the support of Paul.)
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To: bruinbirdman

4 l8r


30 posted on 03/20/2011 11:40:24 PM PDT by Tunehead54 (Nothing funny here ;-)
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To: preacher

A little misleading, there. There has been at least one US reactor accident which killed more than one, even if it was not a commercial power plant.


31 posted on 03/20/2011 11:44:56 PM PDT by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly. Stand fast. God knows what He is doing.)
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To: volunbeer

Actually, I was a “refugee” from the Nuclear Power industry bust of the 70’s. I ended up in aerospace (rocket propulsion) and retired a couple of years ago. I always felt that the industry was killed by unfounded fear mongering from nuclear Luddites. I sure a lot of these Luddites bought into the Global Warming scam and it amused me to no end when some of them advocated nuclear power as a way to reduce carbon emissions. I wonder how they expect to get these new power plants built when the industrial infrastructure required to produce them has been scattered to the winds.


32 posted on 03/21/2011 12:33:13 AM PDT by tony549 (Stuck in SoCal)
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To: bruinbirdman
Why we need a Small Rugged Reactor…

A small rugged LFTR could provide electrical energy to these bases in Afghanistan that currently rely on shipments of vulnerable petroleum. Furthermore, the high-temperature capabilities of LFTR mean that we could also synthesize hydrocarbons to fuel vehicles on site, rather than trucking them in. ....................
A small LFTR unit would be brought in to a military site in the form of a few standard containers. One would hold the reactor, its fuel and blanket processing system, and the primary heat exchangers, all within a strong and sealed containment system. etc..............
33 posted on 03/21/2011 12:41:45 AM PDT by caveat emptor (zippety doo dah)
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To: caveat emptor

You talking about Samantha Carters Naquadah generator??????? LOL


34 posted on 03/21/2011 2:34:58 AM PDT by org.whodat
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To: rahbert

You asked, “He know this how?”

Good grief man, I don’t think you spent more than 30 seconds on your answer.

If, as you quoted, Sorenson is considered an expert on thorium - then he would have to be a total idiot, not to know about the safety features in a Chinese thorium reactor.

What do you think experts do about their chosen field - hide under a rock until someone actually makes a working model so that he can act surprised.

Think man think!

Lurking’


35 posted on 03/21/2011 2:51:50 AM PDT by LurkingSince'98 (Catholics=John 6:53-58 Everyone else=John 6:60-66)
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To: Robe; bruinbirdman
"China is not the only one .. India has a working Thorium reactor now.."

Excuse me, but India has been THE leader in this technology. China is a latecomer.

36 posted on 03/21/2011 4:54:13 AM PDT by Wonder Warthog
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To: rahbert

Not to mention... how is a good thing that in the event the reactor overheats, all the coolant (ie: the salt) is drained out?

That’s on par with saying that Japan’s Fukashima reactors are now safer because all the coolant (aka: the water) was drained out.


37 posted on 03/21/2011 4:57:56 AM PDT by gogogodzilla (Live free or die!)
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To: volunbeer
The "fast breeder" technology referred to here is using the same U235 to Pu cycle used in todays non-breeders. To make this work, you have to have a non-water moderator. The problem with that FB technology is the "proliferation problem" of easy access to bomb-making material. Thorium doesn't breed as fast, but avoids the proliferation thing.

And no, this is NOT the same as the "pebble bed reactor", which still has significant safety problems (though not of the "China-Syndrome" type), and is no further along in development than the Indian thorium reactor.

38 posted on 03/21/2011 5:00:28 AM PDT by Wonder Warthog
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To: tony549

My understanding is that the Indians are using molten sodium, not flourine salts, for their thorium design.


39 posted on 03/21/2011 5:05:30 AM PDT by gogogodzilla (Live free or die!)
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To: gogogodzilla
the Indians are using molten sodium

So, if a heat exchanger leaks, is that compatible with water? (Arf arf arf)

Why are all these "cutting edge" nuclear plants still using steam engine technology to generate electricity? What's next, nuclear steam locomotives?

Is there a good reason why there isn't a concept capturing the nuclear reaction's frenzied electron activity and converting it directly into usable electric power?

40 posted on 03/21/2011 5:46:23 AM PDT by ROCKLOBSTER (Celebrate Republicans Freed the Slaves Month)
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