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To: Sherman Logan

>>>The closest I have seen confuse the trade deficit or surplus with the tariff taxes. Prior to the war, by far the largest export item from the USA was raw cotton. But the US has never had any taxes on exports.<<<

Note that nearly all Southern congressmen opposed the tariff, and nearly all Northern congressmen supported it. That, in itself, should provide some insight into which region the tariff hurt or helped.

>>>I’ve never seen any real quantification.<<<

I posted the following link in an earlier post:
http://www.ashevilletribune.com/archives/censored-truths/Morrill%20Tariff.html

The following excerpts from that link provide additional insight:

“The Southern economy was largely agricultural and geared to exporting a large portion of its cotton and tobacco crops to Europe. In the 1850’s the South accounted for anywhere from 72 to 82% of U. S. exports. They were largely dependent, however, on Europe or the North for the manufactured goods needed for both agricultural production and consumer needs. Northern states received about 20% of the South’s agricultural production. The vast majority of export volume went to Europe. A protective tariff was then a substantial benefit to Northern manufacturing states, but meant considerable economic hardship for the agricultural South.”
. . .

“In May of 1860 the U. S. Congress passed the Morrill Tariff Bill (named for Republican Congressman and steel manufacturer, Justin S. Morrill of Vermont) raising the average tariff from about 15% to 37% with increases to 47% within three years. Although this was remarkably reminiscent of the Tariffs of Abomination which had led in 1832 to a constitutional crisis and threats of secession and armed force, the U. S. House of Representatives passed the Bill 105 to 64. Out of 40 Southern Congressmen only one Tennessee Congressman voted for it.

U. S. tariff revenues already fell disproportionately on the South, accounting for 87% of the total. While the tariff protected Northern industrial interests, it raised the cost of living and commerce in the South substantially. It also reduced the trade value of their agricultural exports to Europe. These combined to place a severe economic hardship on many Southern states. Even more galling was that 80% or more of these tax revenues were expended on Northern public works and industrial subsidies, thus further enriching the North at the expense of the South.”


The article states that Lincoln signed the tariff into law a few days after inauguration. But most sources state Buchanan signed it a couple of days prior to the inauguration (which I believe is correct). No matter. Both supported the tariff—Buchanan because it helped Pennsylvania.

The article states accurately that Lincoln campaigned for the Morrill Tariff, so his views were well known to the Southern states prior to his election.


189 posted on 11/06/2010 10:24:06 PM PDT by PhilipFreneau
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To: PhilipFreneau
They were largely dependent, however, on Europe or the North for the manufactured goods needed for both agricultural production and consumer needs.

Like what? What agricultural machinery did they depend on Europe for? What consumer goods did they import in such massive quantities?

191 posted on 11/07/2010 4:15:52 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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To: PhilipFreneau; LS; Non-Sequitur; rockrr; rustbucket
PhilipFreneau: "“In May of 1860 the U. S. Congress passed the Morrill Tariff Bill (named for Republican Congressman and steel manufacturer, Justin S. Morrill of Vermont) raising the average tariff from about 15% to 37% with increases to 47% within three years.
Although this was remarkably reminiscent of the Tariffs of Abomination which had led in 1832 to a constitutional crisis and threats of secession and armed force, the U. S. House of Representatives passed the Bill 105 to 64.
Out of 40 Southern Congressmen only one Tennessee Congressman voted for it."

Sorry pal, but your numbers stink to high heaven.

The 35th US Congress (1858 to 1860) ended with 237 members, of whom 116 were Democrats.
Of those 116 Democrats, almost 2/3 -- 76 -- were Southerners.
Now add to those: another 15 Southern Congressmen of the allied American Nativist, "Know Nothing" Party.

In other words, as of 1860, the South's 76 Democrat congressmen controlled the 116 Democrats, and with another 15 "Know Nothings" made up an absolute majority of the House of Representatives' 237 members.

Point is: as of 1860 nothing could pass Congress which the South was determined to oppose.

Furthermore, President "Dough-Faced" Buchanan was also a Democrat and highly sympathetic to the Southern cause.

So this whole notion that the South was somehow being run roughshod over by some massive Northern government is ludicrous.

The real truth is: the South effectively controlled the Federal Government from the founding of the Republic until the day it walked away in secession.

192 posted on 11/07/2010 8:06:33 AM PST by BroJoeK (a little historical perspective....)
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To: PhilipFreneau
U. S. tariff revenues already fell disproportionately on the South, accounting for 87% of the total.

I am aware this number is frequently tossed around, but I am afraid I find it very difficult to swallow.

Tariffs are taxes on imports, collected at the port of entry. They are essentially a sales tax and like all sales taxes are paid in the long run by the consumer.

In 1860 the slave states had about 9M people and the free states about 22M. Of the 9M, about 4M, the slaves, lived by definition in the most extreme poverty and consumed very little.

This means that if the above statement is true, 5M people, or 16% of the US population, managed to consume 87% of the goods on which tariffs were charged.

I hope you will forgive me if I find it more than a little difficult to agree that the average white person in the south consumed between 5x and 6x as much in tariffed goods as the average white northerner.

193 posted on 11/07/2010 11:09:56 AM PST by Sherman Logan (You shall know the truth, and it shall piss you off)
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