Posted on 11/04/2010 3:13:46 AM PDT by markomalley
You said, “Because the economic sectors of those states reliant on slavery didn’t have sufficient political power to lead their states into rebellion. Every state that seceded had greater than 25% of its population as slaves. None of the four slave states that remained loyal to the United States had more than 20%, and the average of the four was more like 11% slave. Even the order in which the states seceded, with a couple of exceptions, almost directly reflects their percentage of slave population.”
My point was more that these states within the union were still allowed to even have slaves which proves that this war was not about freeing slaves and abolishing slavery.
Wrong. Those states seceded in reaction to Lincoln calling for troops after the south fired on Ft. Sumter, and long before any US forces stepped foot into their territory. Of course, this was exactly the reason that the confederate states chose to fire on Sumter in the first place, to push the wavering states into their camp.
David is extremely proud of his heritage and has stated several times that his ancestors were fighting for Mississippi and to protect their families back home.
Slavery would have ended and was phasing out. Lincoln knew that. The war wasn't about slavery. It was suppressing an Revolution of Independence.
Who said it was? Certainly not Lincoln. On the other hand, there are certainly plenty of southerners who said that their rebellion was because of the threat to slavery that they perceived.
The fact is that abolishing slavery throughout the United States would have required a constitutional amendment, and the slave states were numerous enough to insure that would never happen. And even when the war was underway, Democrats held enough seats in congress to block an amendment, although Lincoln kept pushing for one. It was only after the election of 1864, when the Republicans increased their seats, that they had sufficient votes to send the 13th amendment to the states.
Now, unfortunately, we have slavery to credit card and mortgage companies, slavery of hookers to their pimps, and slavery to our masters the federal government. Do you support the revolution that happened Tuesday and will continue over the next few years? Are you a rebel?
Good question.
Wrong. It was the confederates who first violated Kentucky's neutrality by occupying the town of Columbus, which had the effect of discrediting the secessionists in the state.
Then surely you won't have any trouble pointing to some quotes from Lincoln and from southern political leaders saying as much.
Automation was coming on strong - the cotton gin, steam engines and soon to come combustion engines.
You do realize that the advent of the cotton gin heightened the interest in, and the utilization of slaves, not diminished it, right?
Now, unfortunately, we have slavery to credit card and mortgage companies, slavery of hookers to their pimps, and slavery to our masters the federal government. Do you support the revolution that happened Tuesday and will continue over the next few years? Are you a rebel?
This is irrelevant to the conversation, but as you answered my question, I will answer yours. I reject your characterization of the use of the term "slavery" in these contexts as I believe them inappropriate (except, perhaps, or the hooker & pimp although I fail to see the propriety of including that!). Did I support the electing of conservatives? Absolutely. Am I a rebel? In some ways, yes.
LOL Shame on me hey.
Some lefty, smelly, slackers knickers are getting in a twist as they read that post I bet.
I suppose that's the same reason why Davis finally agreed to allow blacks into the ranks in 1865? Having slaughtered almost all of that part of his available white population that hadn't already deserted he was getting kind of desperate?
Had Lincoln chosen a measured response, such as sending a contingent of marines to invade and recapture the island on which Sumter was located or even to occupy Charleston's harbor area, I doubt you would have gotten the same response.
Substantial areas of the south (what is now West Virginia and populations on both sides of the Appalachians, especially eastern Tennessee) didn't ever warm to the Confederacy, or did so only late in the conflict in reaction to the Union Army's deprivations.
The first major shooting battle of the war was a direct reaction to the Union Army's invasion of Virginia.
So it wasn't practical, but it was competitive?
Automation was coming on strong - the cotton gin, steam engines and soon to come combustion engines.
Cotton was a hand labor-intensive crop, and it wasn't automated until the 1940s, when the first practical cotton picking machines came onto the market and when herbicides developed as a by-product of WW2 research ended the need for hand chopping and weeding. Would slavery have persisted until until then? Coincidentally, that was about the time that sharecropping, the labor system that replaced bond slavery with debt peonage, faded away.
Moreoever, not every slave was working on a plantation. Many were household help in the towns and cities. Why would automation make owning your housekeeper less attractive?
No. Why not tell us all about it?
How about the rushing of troops to Kentucky before to war to preempt them from succeeding?
A few minutes on Google would have shown you that the U.S. didn't send any troops into Kentucky until after Leonidas Polk had violated their neutrality by sending in rebel troops.
Slavery would have ended and was phasing out.
Another good one! Pray tell how was it being 'phased out'?
From the rebel standpoint it was all about slavery.
There’s a black guy(not African American as Africans can be white too) near where I live who has a rebel flag on his truck.
I bumped into him at a flying J off I-95, near me and we got talking.
Just at that time near the main entrance a couple of college kids from up north came through the doors and had parked to get Gas next to the black guy’s truck.
We heard them talking about the flag and one of them saying , “well we’re downn south now with the rednecks and racist”
They all laughed at the stupid bigoted remark.
The black guy turned to them and said “hey that’s my truck you got a problem with it?”
They all looked at each other, couple of them laughed nervously and then look totally confused .
They then walked into flying J with heads down totally confused.
The looks of their face was a master card moment and never to be forgot.
Both of us laughed like crazy over the incident and every time we see each other we still talk about it.
Incidentally he also went to the Tampa rebel flag’s raising(biggest rebel flag to be flying in the world right now)
I'm sorry but that whole paragraph is flat out ridiculous.
It was ordered by the confederate government in Montgomery, not by the South Carolina government.
Had Lincoln chosen a measured response, such as sending a contingent of marines to invade and recapture the island on which Sumter was located or even to occupy Charleston's harbor area, I doubt you would have gotten the same response.
So let's see. Ft. Sumter is in a harbor, surrounded by enemy batteries that have just forced it to surrender. And your plan is to chug some boats into that harbor, under the enemy guns, land some marines and then what? Wait for them to be shelled into submission, too?
That was not my area of concentration (I wrote my thesis on the military side, really) but I read the book. It was 30 years ago, so I don't remember the title, but I know it was by Genovese.
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