Catholic sex scandal as undercover reporter 'films priests at gay clubs and having casual flings'

Mail on line ^ | 7/23/10 | Nick Pisa

[Nachum]

A gay priest sex scandal has rocked the Catholic Church in Italy today after a weekly news magazine released details of a shock investigation it had carried out.

Using hidden cameras, a journalist from Panorama magazine - owned by Italian Prime Minister and media baron Silvio Berlusconi - filmed three priests as they attended gay nightspots and had casual sex.

Today there was no immediate comment from the Italian Bishops Conference and the Vatican - which has been rocked by a series of sex scandals involving paedophile priests since the start of the year.

[vladimir998]

You wrote:

“You keep believing that and the evil will continue.”

Evil will continue to happen in any case. Where you find PEOPLE you will find EVIL. Look at the anti-Catholics here.

[wmfights]

LOL!

Fair enough.

[blessu]

“Also, married clergy bring something to the table that celibate clergy don’t. Married clergy live the problems all couples have. There is no way a celibate man understands how hard it is to raise a child, or make a marriage work.”

Let’s try your logic on a few other fields:

There is no way a sober man can counsel an alcoholic.

There is no way a heart surgeon can be a good heart surgeon unless he has had a heart attack.

The best psychiatrist is someone who is psychotic.

[ichabod1]

Yes, and many forget that at one time the BSA had pederast troubles just as bad as the RCC in America. But they FIXED their problem, and earned themselves the undying enmity of our communist overlords.

[wmfights]

Where they do belong, is a problem. A significant problem, I think, for a Catholic man with a homosexual tendency who is struggling to live chastely.

FWIW, there are good Christian organizations like Exodus that help men/women overcome this affliction by the grace of God.

[ichabod1]

Your argument only makes sense if you believe that this society is not decadent and depraved and in the process of being brought to its KNEES by unbridled sexual passion and behavior. Controlling and redirecting the sexual energy into marriage and the family is the only civilizing force that has EVER WORKED and losing it guarantees the rise of the new barbarism, which we see everywhere today.

[Pyro7480]

Here’s your main problem, Doc. You make all these wild allegations and accusations about the Catholic Church, and you expect everyone to just lie down and nod in agreement, just like the subjects were supposed to nod in agreement that the emperor was wearing clothes when he wasn’t. And when a Catholic calls you out on it, instead of coming clean to your wildness, you get stuck on stupid.

[wmfights]

Let’s try your logic on a few other fields:

If you think a bunch of guys who have never had relationships with women, don't have children and live in a cloistered environment can really understand what people go through your welcome to your situation. If you look at the Biblical model you will find preachers were married. In fact one of the criteria for becoming an elder was the quality of the man's marriage.

Requiring clergy to be celibate only leads to attracting those that are a bit off. I'm sure there are some that can do it, but most men can't.

[wmfights]

Your argument only makes sense if you believe that this society is not decadent and depraved and in the process of being brought to its KNEES by unbridled sexual passion and behavior.

When has society not had this tendency.

Controlling and redirecting the sexual energy into marriage and the family is the only civilizing force that has EVER WORKED and losing it guarantees the rise of the new barbarism, which we see everywhere today.

I'm a little confused where you believe we have a disagreement.

[GraceG]

If you look around the world at any sort of religious order that runs on the ideals that the men in it be totally chaste and celibate you will find that a rather significant percentage of those holy men are Homosexual.

This is because it creates a vacuum in society where the gay men gravitate to because if they become a “Holy Chaste Man” they will not have to abide by the social conventions of settling down in a Normal relationship with a woman. So the choice for them is to become an outcast of society, ie. “That single Bachelor guy that people about behind his back”, or a Holy Man in a Holy temple that the community and his own family are proud of. Obviously the Homosexual will be tempted to take the more “socially acceptable” route and join the Holy Men in the Temple.

Where do we see this in the world?

Islamic Clerics
Buddhist Monks
Roman Catholic Priests
Christian Priests
etc... etc...

It is a well established pattern, while there really are a lot of chaste and virtuous religions men out there who take their vows seriously, there are a lot of pretenders in the flock using it as a refuge.

[Irisshlass]

Sick obsession I think.

[RnMomof7]

I think the behavior precedes the ordinatio . The priesthood offered a respectable “closet”. Now I do think some men that would be normally heterosexual are drawn into the behavior because we are made to have intimate relationships.

[Grunthor]

I agree with you on the idea of at least looking at the idea of allowing Priests to marry but I don’t know how effective it would be in weeding out the queers.

[marshmallow]

How long will it be before Rome realizes if it REALLY wants to get rid of this cancer it needs to lift its celibacy requirement so it doesn't attract homosexuals? Unless that's what it wants to attract.

Right.

And proof of that point is the Anglican Church, for instance, where clergy are allowed to marry and which attracts no homosexuals. Instead of hanging out at gay bars, they live openly together in the vicarage and even have their "unions" blessed.

Uh-huh. That's fixed the problem.

Firstly, there will always be homosexuals attempting to take on the ordained state. Irrespective of whether celibacy is optional or not. This "cancer" will never be entirely eliminated to the point where there is not one actively homosexual priest. The key is to screen out as many as possible and that will occur when a) the lavender mafia themselves are not in charge of running the ship, b)bishops and seminary rectors accept the fact that there is a problem with the lavender mafia and c) they decide to enforce Church discipline.

That's all that is required. A break down in Church discipline has brought this about.

That will bring with it its own problems of course and a few years down the road we'll be accused of "hate crimes" if this discipline is put into effect but that's a story for another day. We'll still be under the cosh but it will be a different group doing the beating.

[wmfights]

I think the behavior precedes the ordinatio . The priesthood offered a respectable “closet”. Now I do think some men that would be normally heterosexual are drawn into the behavior because we are made to have intimate relationships.

I agree with you on both counts.

God has designed us to desire a close relationship with someone of the opposite gender. It makes us better.

[wmfights]

And proof of that point is the Anglican Church, for instance, where clergy are allowed to marry and which attracts no homosexuals.

It's an interesting point. In the Anglican case they are in the process of splitting into two different churches. A liberal deviant run body and a conservative body led by clergy in Africa. It seems the only thing left is the fight over who owns what property.

IOW, the Christians are leaving because their church can't be reformed and they know what the liberals are doing is wrong.

Firstly, there will always be homosexuals attempting to take on the ordained state. Irrespective of whether celibacy is optional or not. This "cancer" will never be entirely eliminated to the point where there is not one actively homosexual priest.

I agree it's a cancer that can never be completely eliminated. However, you will find a more well adjusted clergy if they aren't expected to live an abnormal lifestyle.

That will bring with it its own problems of course and a few years down the road we'll be accused of "hate crimes" if this discipline is put into effect but that's a story for another day.

You're right, but who says doing the right thing is always popular.

[Mrs. Don-o]

Bless you! It's a pleasure to communicate with someone so gracious and reasonable.

I'll have to pause a moment and think about, hmm, what's actually prohibited in marital relations.

Actually just now, just yesterday and today, I have got involved in a discussion about this on a Catholic women's list: specifically we are discussing a topic known as "The Theology of the Body," and how it is interpreted somewhat differently by two esteemed teachers, Christopher West and Dr. Alice von Hildebrand. (Alice von Hildebrand is a philosopher and the author of "The Privilege of Being a Woman"; Christopher West is a lecturer on sex and ethics, and is the author of "Good News About Sex and Marriage" and "Theology of the Body for Beginners".)

What these two agree on in the huge swath of "positives": in other words, the "goods" of marital sex: love, consent, divine and natural law, faithful lifelong marriage bond, etc. The absolute prohibitions are relatively few: contraception, abortion, sodomy, that sort of thing.

We're all working this out. The controversy at hand between two very faithful Catholic approaches (embodied by West and Hildebrand) is that West takes a somewhat more expressive/liberty-emphasizing approach and addresses popular culture in its own terms (rather frank language, "whatever is not prohibited is permitted") whereas Dr. von Hildebrand uses more modest, restrained philosophical language and is more ready to prohibit certain kinds of, shall we say, sex variations within marriage, as unseemly and unsacred.

That's as well as I can do right here without falling into tooo-o-o much informationnnn-n-n.

Here's a link to Von Hildebrand, and if it's helpful and relevant to your inquiry, let me know and I can also send some links to West, and my own response.

Sorry if I'm writing too long. I didn't have enough time to write short. :o)

And again, thank you for good discussion.

[dangerdoc]

In my experience married clergy usually brings a pretty good piano player too.

[Mrs. Don-o]

Thank you for mentioning Exodus. They've got a lot of good people. There is also a Catholic group for people with homosexual tendencies learning to live lives of sexual purity, called "Courage" (Link)

But they seem to be a tiny and struggling band, compared to the huge confusing and corrupting forces of Gay "Pride." It makes my heart ache.

[rarestia]

Gay men are going to seek the church as an excuse to not have to tell their parents that they’re gay. It’s a convenient thing to claim fealty to the Lord, when it suits your purposes, but when confronted with the “temptation” of homosexuality during seminary or even later in life with children, these men turn to the highest moral sexual perversion in children.

It’s a shame really. I took in a lot of life from my church as a boy, and I never once felt uncomfortable around any of my Pastors. They were easy to talk to, and they genuinely exuded a love for the Lord.

My biggest problem with this sphere of “issues” is that the media is going to continue to shove homosexual “normalcy” down our throats. We’ve surpassed the stage where it’s immodestly funny, and I, as a heterosexual man, take offense to having this sort of vulgarity on display.