“Care to tell me which of THEM was a civilian? “
Harrison Schmitt didn’t go to the moon? He was a geologist. To be accurate, Neil Armstrong himself was no longer military - he was a civilian employee of NASA by the time he went to the moon.
“Yes there were civilians before Challenger but NOT for a long time thereafter.”
You might want to tell George Nelson that. He flew on STS-26, the mission immediately after Challenger and was not only a civilian at the time, but had never been in the military.
I don’t know what your hang-up is with civilians. The reason most pilot astronauts are at least ex-military, is that pretty much no one but the US taxpayer can pay for the requisite flight experience. Quite a few other jobs are done by those civilians you despise and apparently think are incompetent and the source of all problems.
You completely miss my point and the total object of this thread.
My entire argument here is that THESE ASTRONAUTS SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO SEE THE FREAKIN' TROOPS BECAUSE THEY ARE ALL EX-MILITARY AND THEY ARE NO STRANGER TO DANGER!! Many (like Lovell) are combat vets.
Sayin' that this is no tourist destination belittles their experiences in the military and their abilities to handle themselves in life threatening situations where folks might be trying to KILL them! Cripes, I have no beef with civilians flying the shuttle. That's not the point. The point is that some A$$HAT in the administration is trying to keep these heroes out who wish to put it all out on the line AGAIN, to go make our troops feel better -- so let them! If the civilians from the shuttle program want to go, LET THEM GO TOO, but it might get a little MORE hairy for them if they've not been SHOT AT BEFORE as Lovell has or perhaps some of the others.
That's it! Read a little more carefully will you PUH-LEASE, next time?