BREAKING -- Berg v Obama - Scheduled for SCOTUS Conference TWICE on Jan 16

US Supreme Court ^ | 12/23/08 | US Supreme Court

[BP2]

No. 08-570
Title:	Philip J. Berg, Petitioner v. Barack Obama, et al.
Docketed:	October 31, 2008
Lower Ct:	United States Court of Appeals for the Third Circuit

Case Nos.:	(08-4340)
	Rule 11

~~~Date~~~	~~~~~~~Proceedings  and  Orders~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Oct 30 2008	Petition for a writ of certiorari before judgment filed. (Response due December 1, 2008)
Oct 31 2008	Application (08A391) for an injunction pending the disposition of the petition for a writ of certiorari, submitted to Justice Souter.
Nov 3 2008	Supplemental brief of applicant Philip J. Berg filed.
Nov 3 2008	Application (08A391) denied by Justice Souter.
Nov 18 2008	Waiver of right of respondents Federal Election Commission, et al. to respond filed.
Dec 1 2008	Motion for leave to file amicus brief filed by Bill Anderson.
Dec 8 2008	Application (08A505) for an injunction pending the disposition of the petition for a writ of certiorari, submitted to Justice Souter.
Dec 9 2008	Application (08A505) denied by Justice Souter.
Dec 15 2008	Application (08A505) refiled and submitted to Justice Kennedy.
Dec 17 2008	DISTRIBUTED for Conference of January 9, 2009.
Dec 17 2008	Application (08A505) denied by Justice Kennedy.
Dec 18 2008	Application (08A505) refiled and submitted to Justice Scalia.
Dec 23 2008	Application (08A505) referred to the Court.
Dec 23 2008	DISTRIBUTED for Conference of January 16, 2009.	---------------

No. 08A505
Title:	Philip J. Berg, Applicant v. Barack Obama, et al.
Docketed:
Lower Ct:	United States Court of Appeals for the Third Circuit

Case Nos.:

(08-4340)

~~~Date~~~	~~~~~~~Proceedings  and  Orders~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dec 8 2008	Application (08A505) for an injunction pending the disposition of the petition for a writ of certiorari, submitted to Justice Souter.
Dec 9 2008	Application (08A505) denied by Justice Souter.
Dec 15 2008	Application (08A505) refiled and submitted to Justice Kennedy.
Dec 17 2008	Application (08A505) denied by Justice Kennedy.
Dec 18 2008	Application (08A505) refiled and submitted to Justice Scalia.
Dec 23 2008	Application (08A505) referred to the Court.
Dec 23 2008	DISTRIBUTED for Conference of January 16, 2009.

[editor-surveyor]

"I was am a natural born citizen and I was born not long after Obama and outside of the United States.
I have a Birth Certificate issued by the US Embassy to prove it."

If both of your parents were citizens at the time, and subsequent residency requirements were met, then you are correct, but failure on any of those counts would mean that you are not. It only matters if you run for president.

[editor-surveyor]

"Chief Justice Roberts and Justices Scalia, Thomas and Alito looked at that argument a few weeks ago and did not see any merit."

That is a false statement. That issue was not a part of the action that they perused.

[Colorado Cowgirl]

No balls, no guts, No Glory!. A very sad state of affairs. Every morning I turn on the News, thinking “Now What?”

[El Gato]

Generally speaking, if your case is not even heard in any of the lower courts, its kind of stupid to keep appealing the case to SC.

Except when what you are appealing is the failure of the lower courts to hear your case.

[El Gato]

The COLB Obama has presented would be sufficient documentation to get a SS Card, a Passport and DL. And as far as I can tell, there is no requirement that a President Elect present more documentation.

The document was altered, by blanking out the file number. By it's own terms, that makes it invalid. Plus it was only presented electronically to some sites, and only physically to FactCheck.org. Try getting a DL, SS card, etc, with an altered version of your CoLB. Or one without a seal, as the images all were, until FactCheck presented some really badly taken pictures of it, supposedly the same one, after folks had noted that missing seal, and wallah, a seal appears where not a hint of one could be seen before.

And if he were born in Kenya, yes he is a liar but he would still be a natural born citizen in that at the moment of his birth he became an American.

Even if true, that would not necessarily make him a Natural born citizen. But it turns out not to be true. If he was born outside the US, to an 18 year old US Citizen and a foreign national, he was not even a citizen at birth, let alone a natural born citizen.

But just keep saying that, as others have before you, and someone might believe you. But I wouldn't hold my breath.

[kennedy]

You know, Hitler believed that lunch should be served around noon every day. That doesn't mean believing that 12:00pm is a good time to eat lunch indicates that one is a Nazi.

Godwin's Law of Nazi Analogies: "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one."

[mlo]

"If both of your parents were citizens at the time, and subsequent residency requirements were met, then you are correct, but failure on any of those counts would mean that you are not."

If he was a citizen at birth he was a natural born citizen. That's all it means. There is nothing in the constitutional requirements for president that requires his parents to be citizens.

[Eye of Unk]

Is this a bug zapper thread yet? It sure looks like its attracting pests.

[MHGinTN]

Careful, mlo will hit the abuse button on you for hinting at trolls.

[Gemsbok]

Truman,
How do you know that you are labelled natural-born, does your documentation from the US Embassy state this fact?

[El Gato]

I was am a natural born citizen and I was born not long after Obama and outside of the United States. I have a Birth Certificate issued by the US Embassy to prove it.

You have a certificate proving you were a citizen at birth. But no where in the law, and only the first naturalization law passed by Congress, since repealed, is "natural born" mentioned. I'll bet your BC doesn't say that either.

But if both of your parents, or just your father was a US Citizen, then by the common law definition, the one the framers were using, you are a natural born citizen.

In the common law of most countries, natural born goes by the citizenship status of the parents/father. But in the English speaking countries, both by common and statute law, it is also conferred by place of birth. At least according to Blackstone, probably the most cited analyst of English common law during the founding period.

[John Valentine]

...not (sic) basis that Obama is not a natural born citizen.

Where the heck have you been? While some of Berg's case is questionable, the essential facts of his parentage - admitted by Obama himself - squarely and decisively place him OUTSIDE of "natural born citizen" status.

To be "natural born" one must be born within the United States to TWO US citizen (but not necessarily natural born) parents. Obama was not, and although (if born in Hawaii) he is definitely a US citizen as a result of the circumstances of his birth and the operation of statute law, he is not and never can be a "natural-born" citizen as demanded by the Constitution as a qualification to the Presidency. That is unless Unless the Supreme Court were to rule against all precedent, and to do that, they would have to agree to hear the case. Basically, under the law as it exists, and conforming to stare decisis, he is not qualified on the basis of self-admitted facts. The Supreme Court would have to take the case to clear the road for his inauguration.

You need to bone up on your legal scholarship, and FR is a good place to start.

[luvadavi]

Say,'dogz, how much do they pay you trolls? Flat rate or per post?

Nobody infests thread after thread for weeks, months, with their one-track mind comments--for nothing.

[El Gato]

Now, can you find something in the Constitution, Legislation or Case Law that defines Natural Born Citizen?

The Constitution defines very few of its terms. The Congress has power to provide for uniform naturalization, but not to define "natural born" for Constitutional purposes, any more than they can redefine "arms" for purposes of the Second Amendment. There is no case law, as there has never been any challenge in courts to the eligibility of a Presidential candidate based on not being "natural born". There was only one other were it was even discussed, and he was Vice Presidential candidate who became President, Chester Arthur. In his case it was alleged, variously, that he was not born in the US and that his father was not a US Citizen at the time of his birth. From what I've read, it seems likely that the latter was true, but that the former was not. But AFAIK, no court ever examined the issue.

[El Gato]

Also, there is a case, Broe vs. Reed, in the Washington State Supreme Court for January 8, 2009 challenging Obama’s non-citizenship. Subpoenas have been served.

On whom? It seesm all that would be required, if the Court is looking at the merits, rather standing or some other "technical" issue, would be an order to the State of Hawaii, department of Health Statitics, for a certified copy of the long form birth certificate that they say they have.

[Uncle Chip]

Now, can you find something in the Constitution, Legislation or Case Law that defines Natural Born Citizen?

How about 150 years of Presidential precedent during which every President was a living breathing definition of a Natural Born Citizen [except one who hid his past and burned his papers because he knew he wasn't one]. Will that suffice???

[Sola Veritas]

If Mr. Obama was adopted by his mother’s second husband, an Indonesian, then shouldn’t his name still be Soetero(sp?)?

How can he go by Barack H. Obama unless he had a legal name change, or was the Indonesian adoption not recognized by the US?

Can someone clear this up for me?

[John Valentine]

“I was am a natural born citizen and I was born not long after Obama and outside of the United States. I have a Birth Certificate issued by the US Embassy to prove it.”

This person is in exactly the situation of my son, and sorry to burst their self-inflated balloon, he or she is NOT, repeat NOT a natural born citizen.

Just to be clear, although this individual is a citizen of the United States by birth, that status is conferred by statute, not by the Constitution, and the citizen status is well short of natural-born.

My son, Gerald, can NEVER become President, and neither can this individual, unless the Constitution is first amended to permit it.

[bvw]

We wish we could. That very question has been asked a number of times over the months and I think it is a part of some of the lawsuits. The answer is, yes, probably so. But no “due diligence” is allowed of His Obama-ness. We are to trust in Obama, pure simple trust is all the verification “Us Magazine” level politics and milquetoastian hectoring allows. No Reaganesque “Trust, but Verfiy”. All just “TRUST IN HIM, THE OBAMA”.

[devere]

“If Mr. Obama was adopted by his mother’s second husband, an Indonesian, then shouldn’t his name still be Soetero(sp?)? How can he go by Barack H. Obama unless he had a legal name change, or was the Indonesian adoption not recognized by the US? Can someone clear this up for me?”

Yes, Barry Obama can clear it up for you. Please ask him, and then let us know his answer.