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To: shrinkermd

It’s true that there was a long history of estrangement between Rome and Byzantium, embodied in the split between the Roman Catholic and the Orthodox Churches.

But it wasn’t Rome that brought down the ancient Byzantine civilization, it was a combination of internal decadence, and Islam.

Historically, Russia was a bulwark of strength against the Mongol and Muslim invasions. But frankly that went off course and came to an end with the Revolution of 1917.

Now, what you have, I think, is little more than an ancient resentment on the part of Russia. American didn’t put Russia down; they undermined and weakened themselves with a 70-year failed experiment in Communism. Reagan and the Pope only finished what the Russians themselves began by overextending and weakening themselves.

Putin is taking a dangerous and deluded path. He is pretty good at enriching and empowering himself and his friends, but he is leading Russia toward suicide. Russia cannot afford to expand and renew the Soviet Union while they are unable even to reproduce themselves. They won’t have enough Russian population to hold onto Russia, let alone regain and hold an empire.

First things first. They need to restore their economy and their society, stabilize their culture, and make their people happy and healthy enough to start having children again. Otherwise, they are finished. And it has nothing to do with us. They are doing it to themselves. Which, I’m afraid, makes them all the more resentful.


3 posted on 06/01/2008 2:29:47 PM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Cicero
...Reagan and the Pope...

...Reagan, Thatcher and the Pope...

There. Fixed it.

5 posted on 06/01/2008 2:42:24 PM PDT by Publius (Another Republican for Obama -- NOT!!)
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To: Cicero

I suggest that part of the reason for the fall of Constantinople and the Romanoi was the Hungarian cannon. The inventor of these cannon tried to do business with the government of Constantinopolos, but no, they were not interested. The Turks were very interested.

Turning down good ideas. Is that how we define ‘decadance’ today?


6 posted on 06/01/2008 2:56:04 PM PDT by donmeaker (You may not be interested in War but War is interested in you.)
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To: Cicero

But it wasn’t Rome that brought down the ancient Byzantine civilization, it was a combination of internal decadence, and Islam.

Sounds like Europe. Those who don't learn from history....

Historically, Russia was a bulwark of strength against the Mongol and Muslim invasions. But frankly that went off course and came to an end with the Revolution of 1917.

If only the Bolsheviks weren't successful. Who knows, Russia might be fighting Iran instead of selling uranium to them. To have Russia on our side would have drastically altered the global balance of powers. The Middle East would be nothing without their Russian arms dealers.
7 posted on 06/01/2008 2:58:24 PM PDT by G8 Diplomat
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To: Cicero
"But it wasn’t Rome that brought down the ancient Byzantine civilization, it was a combination of internal decadence, and Islam." <

You ever hear of the Crusade of 1204 which attacked and ransacked Byzantium? The Franks fatally compromised the shield that had been protecting Europe. Byzantium never recovered and the Turks later swarmed all the way to Vienna. The Russians are painfully aware of Western duplicity.

9 posted on 06/01/2008 3:03:47 PM PDT by Eternal_Bear (`)
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To: Cicero; RusIvan
Historically, Russia was a bulwark of strength against the Mongol and Muslim invasions. But frankly that went off course and came to an end with the Revolution of 1917.

Yes, but that was thwarted time and again by Britain and France -- when the Russians nearly brought Constantinople back in Christian hands in the 19th century, the British prevented Russia from doing so.
28 posted on 06/02/2008 3:29:40 AM PDT by Cronos ("Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant" - Omar Ahmed, CAIR)
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