Posted on 05/21/2008 5:50:14 PM PDT by Saundra Duffy
Thanks. That is how I see it.
It does seem every house/dwelling was included in the warrant so I guess this same type of thing could happen on any ranch type set up. Scary! To me it is the same as covering all apartments in a building with one warrant for child abuse. I have lived on several ranches where several related and or unrelated families live in seperate houses on the same property and never dreamed that authorities could use that lifestyle as an excuse to search every house if abuse was suspected. If they treated city dwellers the same I bet they would not be allowed to do it long before there would be a stop to it.
It may be legal- but it is not right.
The beginning of what? I was on these threads at the beginning of this issue abt. 2 months ago if that is what you meant- I didn’t see a single poster that said they thought children were property or posted anything that made me think they felt that way. I did see several posters that like to call people names if that person didn’t agree with them 100% on every item. I thought it was childish then and still do.
“The raid on FLDS is something liberal democrats would support. Right down their alley. But so-called conservative Republicans. I am shocked to find so much support for a Janet Reno type raid on this site.”
They are torn between the method and the juicy long hated target.
Hell hath no furry like a christian zealot scorned...
My point is that there are groups in the wings that smile , rub their hands, and ready new target groups for “teaching their values to their children”
If every “I” isnt dotted and every “T” isnt crossed....it should be thrown out.
Justice is to be “applied”...not “inflicted”..
Mormon!
*snicker*
Just wanted to beat someone else to it...
*grin*
Those that know me would really snicker about me being accused of being a Mormon. Probably even have a really long laugh- not just a snicker.
Not FLDS either, hubby would get the biggest kick out of that- at times I’m sure he thinks I am one wife too many.
For some reason the attackers on these threads haven’t called me Mormon or FLDS- I am officialy known as a “cult defender” which is really funny because early on I said if the men were guilty of having sex with children they should be castrated. I am guessing the men of FLDS would not see me as a very good defender.
And I don’t see “tactics.”
CPS did not remove the children because of the story of “Sarah.” They investigated under a warrant based on the original information.
However, the children were removed from the residence - legally, under Texas law - by another warrant issued because of what was observed over 2 days of interviews: girls at the cult compound told them about minors who were “spiritually joined” to older men and the observed presence of minors who were pregnant or who were mothers. The interviews led CPS and the judge to believe that the fathers were older than the mothers and/or that the girls weren’t legally married to the older men. By definition, this is abuse under our law.
Texas Child Protective Services laws and regulations are rightfully biased in favor of the family. Sorting out the players in the FLDS version of the family is full of complications.
Here’s one of the news articles about the MH/MR vs. CPS controversy.
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/texassouthwest/stories/DN-polygamist_12tex.ART.State.Edition1.464687e.html
I would like to see more about the story of the little boy, but haven’t been able to find that through a Google News search.
You keep putting that statistic out like it's something to be proud of. IOWs this group of people don't know who the mothers are of 25%, one out of four, of their children.
Amazing! I'll bet most tribes of the upper Amazon or backwoods Borneo could do better than that.
You have no basis for saying that I’ve been “propagandized soundly.”
I’m informed, using multiple sources for any statement I give. I’ve long been involved in family medicine and State policy making here in Texas, fighting domestic violence and sexual abuse and absolutely pro-family. (I proudly served two terms on President Bush’s National Advisory Committee on Violence Against Women with two of the women who originally sued to overturn the VAW Act, and who were successful in limiting that Act.)
I posted early on that I was concerned about the risk of State vs. family and how to discern between religious discrimination by an arm of the State and true protection of innocents.
Certain acts may not be tolerated, even under the guise of religion and in light of our Federal Constitution’s First Amendment. The rights to life, liberty and property are inalienable and endowed by the Creator, and may not be infringed upon or given away under cover of law or religion. For instance, certain religious groups hold that suicide while killing infidels is a religious act, but our law will not allow it.
The law concerning age of consent and laws limiting parents’ in permitting certain acts under a given age is a line that I’m comfortable with because of the other limits we place on minors entering contracts, the responsibilities of parents, and the absolute benefit of protecting parents’ rights to know about medical procedures done on their daughters and protecting girls from sexual predators who hide their crimes by dumping the girls at abortion clinics.
As I’ve said before, one of the biggest groups advocating for both the Defense of Marriage Act and (Texas) Constitutional Amendment as well as the change to consent for abortion was organized by a pro-life, pro- family Mormon group.
Careful TE, these threads can get mean!
There’s some news reports - but the YFZ are saying there are no children on the compound, but if there are, they’re kids who came in with other members who arrived to help.
http://origin.sltrib.com/ci_9334515
I found a great blog that covers the story.
http://wwwwakeupamericans-spree.blogspot.com/search/label/YFZ%20Ranch
There’s an interview with one of the lawyers http://wwwwakeupamericans-spree.blogspot.com/2008/05/exclusive-interview-with-natalie.html , and news I had missed - there may be many children who don’t match up with any of the mothers on the compound, including one who is from Canada.
Malonis: This is an interesting issue of first impression as far as I know. The Family Code allows a judge to consider whether sexual abuse has occurred in a "household" as a factor in determining whether all other children in that same household are in danger. In that particular section of the Code "household" is not defined, although it is defined elsewhere in sections relating to family violence. I don't think the drafters of the Family Code would have contemplated this kind of communal living. It's unclear whether this type of closed environment fits squarely within the meaning of "household." I think there are very good arguments on both sides of that issue, and some of these cases may well turn on how the Court decides that issue. From her ruling at the 14-day she seems to be considering the community as one household.
Also, isn't it pertinent that one man led the cult, was able to arrange all the interviews, and to influence the women and children to leave quietly?
The lawyer also speaks to the misinformation about names and ages.
Hey ace, how many charges have been filed since April 5th?
Please list the names of those who have been arresed, and what the charges were. Thanks in advance.
Due process bud... don’t leave home without it.
If there were sufficient grounds, there would be cases filed. The authorities look more evil with each passing day and you don’t think they have filed things they can prove? Seriously?
"The person who reported it was an Obama superdelegate......what the hell happened to that story, MSM?"
Not really a superdelegate. This is from an April article in Denverpost.com
"Swinton is also listed on the El Paso County Democratic Party's website as her neighborhood precinct's delegate to the state Democratic convention in May, supporting Sen. Barack Obama."
http://www.denverpost.com/ci_8987062
“There is much misinformation, some of which we are trying to correct “
Well, that’s something everyone can get behind.
” They have mastermind a clever organized disinformation campaign? Hmmm...”
Yes. Jeff’s was training them from birth to lie to authorities. That is a fact.
“It was just 2 weeks ago when many like yourself were claiming these people in this “cult” were zombie like robots, that were not capable of critical thinking.”
Why yes. The CPS tried to ID the children, and the mothers and fathers lied and changed stories, knowing that their children might be taken away, all to protect their glorious leader, or one of the other members of the Loyal Inner Circle.
Giving up your kids for someone who has declared the end of the world, time, and again, means you might be having a problem with ‘critical thinking’.
And yet some blame the state of Texas for not figuring it out right the first time. Kudos to Texas for trying. Now hang em high.
With all the duplicity the cult has engaged in, the state of Texas is being blamed because it made some mistakes when it tried to estimate because it's not omnipotent.
I find it really hard to believe that they could be so far off on the age of a 27 year old. It makes me more suspect that the *proof* of age for that lady is forged. It's not like forged documents don't exist.
Dang wrong omni-
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