Posted on 04/18/2008 7:34:25 PM PDT by Chief Engineer
C.'s Attorney General Wally Oppal has confirmed that some of the 416 children taken by authorities from a polygamist compound in Texas, are Canadian.
Oppal said officials in Ottawa gave him the news.
His statement came after Angie Voss, of Texas child protection services, said during a custody hearing in Texas on Friday that some of the children we from Canada, though she gave no details about how many were there, or how old they were.
The large group of children were seized from the compound after allegations of sexual and physical abuse were made, including forcing underage girls to marry men several times their age.
Oppal told The Canadian Press he had been alerted that some Canadians were involved. He said government officials would be getting involved, though it wasn't clear what their role would be.
Oppal said officials gave him the news because there is also a polygamist compound in Bountiful, B.C., and members have close ties to their American counterparts.
"This has been an issue for quite some time in that it has been said that at Bountiful there are said to be some Americans there as well," Oppal said.
"It sort of adds another dimension to the problem here. That is, that people move in and out of these communities and it's sometimes difficult to find out who's where and what."
Oppal said the call from Ottawa was "giving us a heads up because they know that we're involved in that same issue here."
Unprecedented ruling
In an unprecedented ruling, the judge in the case has ordered that all children in the case will remain in state custody.
The court heard that at least five of the children who are under 18 already have had children of their own.
The children were taken from an Eldorado, Texas compound which belonged to the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
The children, most of whom are being kept in a domed coliseum in San Angelo, range in age from 6 months to 17 years. About 130 are under 4 years old, Voss said.
Voss said that the children are taught "...no age too young to be married."
She added that there is "...a culture of young girls being pregnant by older men."
The court has heard that the girls would have little ability to say no.
Psychiatrist Bruce Perry said a child raised to be absolutely obedient would have, "the independent thinking of a much younger child."
Polygamous marriage is a central tenet for members of the religious sect.
The sect is led by their prophet, Warren Jeffs. Formerly on the FBI's most wanted list, the leader has been convicted and jailed for being an accomplice of rape by forcing a 14-year-old girl to marry her 19-year-old cousin.
He is now awaiting trial on other charges in Arizona. The sect came to West Texas in 2003, moving from its traditional home along the Utah-Arizona state line. Voss said the ranch was considered a special place, the sect's Zion.
Authorities raided the 1,700 acre raid after a call from someone identifying herself as a 16-year-old girl on the ranch. The girls said she was beaten and raped by her 50-year-old husband.
The girl has yet to be identified, though Voss said a girl matching her description was seen by other girls in the ranch garden four days before the raid began.
I disagree entirely with the basis for the warrant. There is our disagreement. The action was wide based, ambiguous, and based on anonymous, and now, apparantly, false information.
You don’t have a problem with that?
In foster homes they will be gangbanged beaten and raped by their brothers, sisters, and neighbors. I guess this “lesser evil” will be more acceptable to you guys. It’s not to me.
but you knew that.
susie
I apologize, the quote was not yours.
susie
I throw up my hands, it is not possible to have a sensible debate with some folks. My hate is off to you tho, you go girl.
susie
I didn’t mean you in particular. It’s just a general lack of outrage at situations like the ones you mentioned and everyone goes ballistic over this one. That’s what I find frustrating.
Some people are acting shocked, like this is the first time something like this has happened. And it isn’t
One thing that blows me away is that some of these people who speak so badly of their government also show up on some of the troop support threads of various sorts. Some of them say they have friends or relatives in the military. Are they aware that these same people are a vital part of their much-hated US government?
And the other, of course, is that they feel that since they once read a copy of the Constitution, now they’re experts. On a couple occasions, I’ve even seen people insist that the 1st Amendment gives them the “right” to do exactly what the fLDS is doing—and one even insists that the Constitution guarantees the freedom to marry at ANY age.
I think I’m with Brytlea. You can’t have a logical debate with the illogical. Heck, you can’t even have a logical DISCUSSION with some of them. FR has been overtaken by the loons.
YOU HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDING!!!!!!! You think that someone who supports our troops cannot seriously questions the road we are taking in this country toward a police state? I don’t know, like a couple of democrat candidates for office that want to make our troops nothing more than people who aid in times of national disaster instead of serving their real purpose of defending our country and our freedoms. If one of them gets into office, and they fulfill this mission, I should just sit back and let them, because I cannot “hate” my government. WOW!!!!
You are the seriously delusional individual. Of course we should question authority in this country. Of course we should keep checks and balances on those who are supposed to be our servants not our overlords. If you can’t separate that from other areas of life, you are delusional.
Baloney. They are part and parcel of the USG, as are we all, one way or another. It’s fine to “trust but verify” but what I’m seeing on here are people who are so blinded by their hatred of the USG that they will let ANY crime be committed rather than allow government (even on the state level) intervention.
This country’s government has had its problems. But it is STILL the best government this world has ever seen, and maybe will ever see. We know about the warts, but surely we also know that sometimes our government gets it right?
There were valid warrants and a valid search; crimes against children were noted, so the children were removed from the homes for their own safety—and to interview for the investigations. This is standard in ALL allegations of child abuse. It was all orderly and as it should have been. That someone—anyone—should try to make this into what it isn’t shows a level of stupidity, or malice against the government bordering on psychosis.
Waco was something else, but this wasn’t Waco. Or maybe that’s what’s bugging you.
Age of consent in Texas is 16, not 13.
Once folks can figure out whose kids these are they'll be returned and actions can then be taken against fathers who violated the law.
You do want to know who the children are don't you?
Is it? Do you think that’s the operative word? Whether it’s compensated or not, if its passed out before the age of consent in Texas it’s AGAINST THE LAW.
I am worried about Michael Reagan though. Have the pods gotten to him or was that just his hack ghost writer taking what she thought was going to be the popular position, or did she simply feel an affinity for the situation ~ like there are some women out there who have this thing about super dominant men and all that ~ if I were Mike, I'd keep her off these stories.
It's no wonder these guys are squealing though ~ the law has struck home to the heart of the cult and is definitely shaking up the place. (That's "shake", not "shack", plenty of the latter going on there).
I disagree with your order. As much as you would love to be delusional in believing, child services doesn’t work in the order you presented and did not work that way in this case.
The actual order went along the lines: we don’t like this religion, we want to stop them, please someone give us a little complaint, valid or verifiable, and we will run with it. Oh, look, got it. Lets run grab all of the kids. Oh, wait, now we need to prove to the courts why we took the children, gotta find that evidence of guilt.
The foundations of this country demand that that must not happen.
I hope that a child never suffers any wrong doing. But we cannot get into the business of being thought police.
There should NEVER be a situation where the government can wholesale seize children (get over your property complaint) and then try to sort out who they belong to.
I am absolutely shocked that your hatred of this religious group allows you to justify this travesty by government entities.
Hey, I don’t hate these people. I love them in fact, and would like for them to move into the 21st century along with the rest of us.
Give us chapter and verse.
I would love for them to move into the 21st century with the rest of us, too. I would love for them not to pervert Christianity, my faith, to suit their power desires.
But, I cannot dictate that. I cannot force other people to believe like I do, or that allows others to force me to believe as they do.
But, the way this was carried out scares me about the overreaching of government entities. There are scores of 13 yo girls in secular society that are pregnant, yet we don’t show the same outrage over that happening. We do not have the same outrage at the entities encouraging that behavior.
Um, what?
But, back to the F(lds) "religion", what part of it is being suppressed at the moment, and what part is it that we don't like?
Aah, are you getting off track now... wanting a little religious debate.
That would probably be the forced marriage/child rape part of the religion, and perhaps the female slavery part of it. Near as I can tell, those are the main “features” that are being suppressed. But I’m not sure they’re covered under the 1st Amendment.
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