Posted on 04/06/2008 5:27:22 AM PDT by SkyPilot
Local and state officials entered the temple of a secretive polygamist sect late Saturday, said lawmen blockading the road to the YFZ Ranch near Eldorado.
The action comes hours after local prosecutors said officials were preparing for the worst because a group of FLDS members were resisting efforts to search the structure.
The Texas Department of Public Safety trooper and Schleicher County sheriff’s deputy confirmed that officials have entered the temple but said they had no word on whether anything occurred in the effort.
The incursion into the temple caps the three-day saga of the state’s Child Protective Services agency removing at least 183 women and children from the YFZ Ranch since Friday afternoon. Eighteen girls have been placed in state custody since a 16-year-old told authorities she was married to a 50-year-old man and had given birth to his child.
Saturday evening, ambulances were brought in, said Allison Palmer, who as first assistant 51st District attorney, would prosecute any felony crimes uncovered as part of the investigation inside the compound.
“In preparing for entry to the temple, law enforcement is preparing for the worst,” Palmer said Saturday evening. They want to have “medical personnel on hand in case this were to go in a way that no one wants.”
Apparently as a result of action Saturday night at the ranch, about 10:15 p.m. Saturday, a Schleicher County school bus unloaded another group of at least a dozen more women and children from the compound.
Although members of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, or FLDS, have provided varying degrees of cooperation to the sheriff’s deputies and Texas Rangers searching the compound, all cooperation stopped once authorities tried to search the gleaming white temple that towers over the West Texas scrub, Palmer said.
“There may be those who would oppose (entry) by placing themselves between law enforcement and the place of worship,” Palmer said Saturday afternoon. “If an agreement cannot be reached … law enforcement will have to — as gently and peaceably as possible — make entry into that place.”
Sect members consider the temple, dedicated by then-leader of the sect Warren Jeffs in January 2005 and finished many months later, off-limits to those who are not FLDS members, said Palmer, who prosecutes felony cases in Schleicher County.
Palmer said she didn’t know the size or makeup of the group inside the temple.
The earlier refusal to provide access was even more disconcerting because CPS investigators have yet to identify the 16-year-old girl or her roughly 8-month-old baby among the dozens removed from the compound, Palmer said.
“Anytime someone says, ‘Don’t look here,’” she said, “it makes you concerned that’s exactly where you need to look.”
The girl told authorities in two separate phone calls a day apart that she was married to a 50-year-old man, Dale Barlow, who had fathered her child, Palmer said.
The joint raid included the Texas Rangers, CPS, Schleicher County and Tom Green County sheriff’s deputies and game wardens from the Texas Department of Parks and Wildlife.
Although CPS and Department of Public Safety officials have described the compound’s residents as cooperative, Palmer disagreed.
“Things have been a little tense, a little volatile,” she said.
Authorities removed 52 children Friday afternoon and 131 women and children overnight Friday. About 40 of the children are boys, said CPS spokeswoman Marleigh Meisner.
No further children have been taken into state custody since Friday, when 18 girls were judged to have been abused or be at imminent risk for abuse. CPS has found foster homes for the girls, Meisner said, and will place them after concluding its investigation.
Meisner declined to comment on the fate of the 119 other children and said authorities were still searching the ranch for others Saturday evening.
“They’re in the process of looking,” she said. “They’re literally about halfway through.”
We do NOT wish to pry into your REASONS; we just want to know what was UNTRUE about PRESBYTERIANISM.
Maybe YOU will get an answer, for it is OBVIOUS that she is IGNORING me for some reason.
Yeah!
I hope you guys have uninterrupted sleep; except for those NAGGING questions that keep running through your heads.
|
| |||||||
| Version Number When Published Brief Description |
Age Year |
Pillar of light |
No. of Person- ages |
Father Present |
Son Present |
Question: Join What Sect? |
Remarks-References |
|
1. Offical version, written 1838,
first Published 1842
(There are minor differences between the various source references,
Ensign Jan 1985, page 14)
|
14
1820 |
yes | 2 |
yes
Both spoke |
yes |
Join none |
Lucy, Hyrum, Samuel, Sophronia join the Presbyterian Church - JSH, pages 49-50, 1981 edition;
Times & Seasons, March, April 1842;
Ensign Jan. 1985, page 14;
Joseph Smith's First Vision by
Milton V. Backamn, Bookcraft, 1971, 1980, Appendix C, page 160f
|
| 2. Dictated by Smith to F.G. Williams, Summer to Nov. 1832 | 14 or 15 | yes |
1 | no |
yes Saw Lord, He "spoke" |
No question,
told "None doeth good",
sins forgiven
|
Joseph Smith's First Vision, Appendix A, page 155f |
|
3. Written by Smith,
his 1832 diary,
in his own hand
|
15 |
yes |
1 |
no |
yes Saw the Lord Jesus Christ |
No question,
told sins forgiven,
all do no good
|
Ensign, Dec. 1984, pages 24-26; ibid, Jan. 1985, page 11 |
|
4. Smith's diary of 1835,
recorded by
Warren Cowdery,
Nov. 9, 1835, conversation of Smith with Joshua
|
About 14 |
yes |
One, then another like unto first |
?
|
?
Second spoke, saw many angels
|
No questions,
told sins forgiven,
Jesus is Son
|
Joseph Smith's First Vision, Appen. B |
|
5. Letter form Smith to
John Wentworth,
editor of Chicago Democrat
|
none |
no |
2 |
? They spoke |
? |
No Question |
Joseph Smith's First Vision, Appendix D;
Ensign, Jan 1985, page 16;
Times & Seasons, Vol 3, pages 706-707, March 1, 1842
|
|
6. Early church leaders
Brigham Young, G.A.Smith,
John Taylor
|
15 |
no |
1 Saw an angel, and asked the angel |
no |
no |
Join none |
See Journal of Discourses,
2:17;
18:239;
13:77, 78;
20:167;
12:333, 334.
|
WE sure would to know upon what EVIDENCE ol' Joe came to this CONCLUSION!
The magic hat, why of course!
He shoulda stuck to rabbits.
Yeah, they sure do...
Mark 7:1-9
1. The Pharisees and some of the teachers of the law who had come from Jerusalem gathered around Jesus and
2. saw some of his disciples eating food with hands that were "unclean," that is, unwashed.
3. (The Pharisees and all the Jews do not eat unless they give their hands a ceremonial washing, holding to the tradition of the elders.
4. When they come from the marketplace they do not eat unless they wash. And they observe many other traditions, such as the washing of cups, pitchers and kettles. )
5. So the Pharisees and teachers of the law asked Jesus, "Why don't your disciples live according to the tradition of the elders instead of eating their food with `unclean' hands?"
6. He replied, "Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written: "`These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me.
7. They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.'
8. You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to the traditions of men."
9. And he said to them: "You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe your own traditions!
Mark 7:13
Thus you nullify the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And you do many things like that."
Galatians 1:13-14
13. For you have heard of my previous way of life in Judaism, how intensely I persecuted the church of God and tried to destroy it.
14. I was advancing in Judaism beyond many Jews of my own age and was extremely zealous for the traditions of my fathers.
Colossians 2:8
See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ.
I see you want to punish them MORE than the 'law' allows...
Interesting!
Hoist on your own petard!
Why?
Why can't the LDS apologists here get hold of MONSON to get direction from GOD on how to resolve this case!
My GOD!!!
They have a LIVING PROPHET® who has a heavenly hotline!!!
Get on with the program, you guys!!!!
I thought they ALL had heavenly hotlines via personal revelation??
Maybe the satellite it out? Sunspots?
Interesting that J.Smith practiced polygamy yet lied about it.
Wonder if there are elders that do the same NOW and only allow the “select” few in on it. While the rest of the LDS just aren’t far enough along in their spiritual maturity?
Why would it be any different now as it was then? Since Mormon’s have no problem with Smith lying why would they have a problem with their leaders lying now?
I like the way you think. Problem is, they'd have to shave their heads to get that much information tatooed on them. Maybe their back would work better....
No DU, Mormon Theology is just as much of a confusing mess as this polygamy nonsense. The whole doctrine of Eternal Progression that the LDS Church teaches (when it isn't denying that it teaches it) is intertwined with the whole idea of Polygmay. The whole three levels of heaven nonsense is also tied to the Polygamy nonsense. That is why a woman will get married for eternity to her Bishop when she is married "for time" to some ex-Mormon or a non-Mormon or an "Unworthy" beer slugging Jack Mormon. She can't get into the Celestial Kingdom unless her Husband calls her through the veil with her secret name, and her husband can't call her through the veil unless he's been declared worthy and knows all the secret handshakes and was buried in the proper underwear.
No, DU, the whole Mormon religion is a "VERY CONFUSING MESS" and you have aptly described it as such when you admitted that the doctrine of Polygamny that is still taught and revered and defended by the LDS Church is a "VERY COINFUING MESS".
I frankly don't see how any thinking man or woman can buy into all this Mormon nonsense. The Polygmany nonsense is just the tip of the iceberg. The rest of the Mormon nonsense is underneath the surface, but it is all a VERY CONFUING MESS. VERY? CONFUSING INDEED. Every jot and tittle of Mormon theology is a very confusing mess.
Thanks for the apt description.
Tradition is just tradition. It's not part of accepted Scripture, the Torah and all. The OT and NT have been basically unchanged for thousands of years. The Dead Sea Scrolls demonstrate how accurately they have been handed down. Once the canon was established by the early church fathers, that about settled it. There's too much controversy over the additional writings that some accept and others don't, for my comfort. I'm not going to take the chance and run into error.
Does that mean that maybe I'm missing some truth? I suppose technically it could but you know what? What's in the Bible that we have now is more than enough for me to manage. I could spend my entire life in a monastery studying it and still come up short on all it has. I don't need to spend time on stuff that is questionable.
Could I be missing truth? Maybe, but after the lifetime of study of the Bible as we have it, I'd still be missing truth. It's simply not possible to NOT miss truth because I'm finite and human and God is God. There's no way to know Him in His totality.
For the record, I think the Bible is complete as it stands and do not give any consideration to extra-Biblical teachings. I do not think they are reliable and therefore do not think that it is safe to give them the confidence that I give the OT and NT.
For real? Us non-Mormons are learning a lot and some of it sounds as unbelievable as this.
Yes, that is for real. Mormon women are given a secret name and they can't get into the highest degree of heaven unless they are married "for Eternity" to a "Worthy" Mormon man who calls them through the veil by calling out that secret name.
If they happen to get hitched to a Jack Mormon then no matter how good they are in this life, they can't get into the Celestial Kingdom unless they get married a second time to some "Worthy" Mormon. The eternal destiny of a Mormon woman is tied directly to the "worthiness" of the man to whom she is married.
This probably explains why the depression rate among women is the highest in Utah?
You know, if the Mormons were up front about what they believed, the general population of this country would laugh themselves silly whenever they came to the door. NOBODY would join their group then.
Small wonder.
Men can be tough enough to live with without my eternal destiny hanging on their behavior.
Pity the woman who makes THAT mistake.
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