[DoughtyOne]

If you truly feel as you do than go sit out November or cast your vote for your 3rd party candidate.  That makes sense.  I will be writing in.

What doesn't make sense is why you push for a McCain and GOP loss.  It doesn't make sense to you that I would fight againt a feau-Conservative becoming a Republican President if I thought it would hurt the special interest group that most had the best interests of this nation at heart?  Really?

It may be as simple as "misery loves company".  I'm not miserable Bob.  How then could I be seeking others to be miserable with me?  I am in fear of watching conservatism utterly destroyed by John McCain, with the help of the democrat politicians, the DNC, the repubublican politicians, the RNC and the nation's MSM.

Tell me what public group will advocate for us during a McCain presidency.  I can tell you five entities that will speak out against us constatantly.  Guys like Bill Krystol will be thrilled to death, to join them.

The moment John McCain becomes president, connservatism becomes a dirty four letter word.  It's members will have to shut their mouths for four years or take a body blow from the five groups I have mentioned, with just about every well respected Repbulican of merit, joining them.  You'll see that played out here on their forum too, if the last eight years are any indication.  That is not a slap at Jim either.  It is expressing my view of some forum participants who have defeneded the indefensible for eight years.

It may be that you validate your own position by getting others to believe as you do.  It's nice to know others agree with me, but I have voiced my opinion here when nobody else did.  My opinion is just that.  I don't put my finger up in the wind to see if I should make certain comments.  I look at the subject and express my views on that subject.  Why would I not think it an insult to have someone lower the bar this low on the validity of my thoughts?

It may be that there are some dem propaganda plants on FR.  Perhaps so, and as you alluded, I am not one of them.

I don't know but I sure would like to and I know others do as well.  I have explained it in minute detail right on this thread.  If folks take the time to read my comments on it, they will see why I think a John McCain term as president would be disasterous for conservatism.

As for the Republican Party, I have no allegiance to it.  I was happy to support it when it was represented by good people.  I do not think John McCain is a good person.

I asked you a question in #273 Bob.  I'd like an answer to that question.

What could a candidate possibly do, that would disqualifiy them as a person you could vote for, just to keep Hillary or Obama out of office?

I'm not asking this question for my benefit Bob.  I honestly don't have a vested interest in the answer for my edification.  If you don't answer, I'm not going to be put off by it.  It is a question that I want folks to ask themselves, if they think voting for John is a good idea, knowing what they know about him.  If they do think he passes that sniff test, then what would it take?  Is there anything at all that he could do to disqualify him in your eyes?  I'll tell you what, don't bother to post.  Just be honest with yourself and I'll be satisifed that you were.

[Bob J]

You’re post shows you responding to my #706 but all the references are from my original post. Was this intended?

Is this the question you want me to answer?

“What could a candidate possibly do, that would disqualifiy them as a person you could vote for, just to keep Hillary or Obama out of office?”

I’m, sorry R, this is a “when did you quit beating your wife” question. To me, political philosophy and political reality are two different things. Philosophically we have opinions and standpoints that define us as a citizen and voter. We work and strive hard to get the person that most reflects our own philosophies into positions of power so those philosophies can be put into action.

The political reality is we live in a country of 300 million, each with his or her one set of philosophies. People that think EXACTLY as you or I do might only make up 2-3% of the population. But 2-3% of the vote is never going to get anyone elected. So we join up with others who have some of the same beliefs as we do and pool our votes, so to speak, to elect someone who generally holds enough of the same philosophies of the group as a whole in the hope that we can get a majority to elect them and when they get into power we can get some of things we believe in a reality.

The entire time you got the other 50% who generally disagree with your positions working against you in the hopes that they can get their candidate elected.

But no matter what, you’re not going to get 100% of what you want, the system doesn’t work that way. If you get 80% you’re hitting bullseyes but I would say if you’re getting 50% that makes the overall effort worthwhile.

I have no illusions about politics. National parties have less to do with precisely defined philosophies than about getting their people elected and that has a lot to do with money. The party in power gets the salaries and budgets. I have seen too many people who I thought could make a difference get ground up and spit out by the system.

This is my opinion of most politicians...they’re either a whore going in or a whore going out. Nobody is clean and everyone is compromised to one degree or another.

If you’re lucky enough that “you’re candidate” wins the primary, good going and congrats. But if he doesn’t you’ve got to suck it up and do the best you can with what you got. I wasn’t a GB man and actually I was horrified when he got the nomination...but I wasn’t surprised, he was the lowest common denominator and in a democratic society it is usually the lowest common denominator that can pull in enough support from everyone to hit that 50%+1.

I won’t even go into how much Bush has disappointed me, but I would still vote for him over Kerry because I know I’ll get some of what I want. The bonus withBush is we got Alito and Roberts and the long term value of that cannot be estimated.

So to answer you’re question, I would vote for any candidate that would give me more of what I want than O or H, has a chance at winning and it doesn’t matter what party theyare affiliated with.

Call me a principled conservative but a pragmatic voter.

You have you’re reasons to vote or not vote as do I. You took umbrage at some of my comments and I understand (although I wasn’t directing them at you, I didn’t make that clear) and will have to be more selective regarding my language in the future. But I take a little umbrage at the implication that those of us who have decided to vote for McCain because we’ll get some of what we desire and to keep the dems out of the White House, have abandoned our principles, our philosophies and our honor.

I understand completely when you say you have to vote your conscious, you’re heart. Don’t criticize others for believing they are also voting with a little reality in mind.