Who's Fueling Whom? - Why the biofuels movement could run out of gas

Smithsonian ^ | November 2007 | Richard Conniff

[P-40]

If you follow the biofuels market in the slightest, when you see someone mixing and matching different technologies and methods and what not, it is obvious that they did not spend a lot of time researching their article.

[P-40]

Were it not for those subsidies, there never would have been a market. The subsidies have attracted a lot of capital to the market and now the market is beginning to drive the process. The subsidies, or more properly tax credits, can be phased out over time or left in place to reflect that the production is from a domestic source.

[P-40]

I think AT&T, CNN, etc. can pay for their own satellite launches....and you would not want a satellite modem; they suck.

[P-40]

Have you written your Congressman about that?

[P-40]

What kind of solar and what kind of biofuels are you talking about?

[PapaBear3625]

A 2GWe nuclear plant dedicated to producing hydrogen operating at 90% electrolytic efficiency would produce hydrogen equivalent to about 26,000 barrels of oil per day. I’m not sure of the current US consumption, but I’m pretty sure that number is well under 1% of total US demand.

So then you build a hundred such plants

One of the biggest costs of building a nuke plant is doing all the studies and paperwork necessary to get approval, plus all the opposition from all the homeowners who would be nearby. It needs to be built fairly close to the electricity consumers, because transmitting electricity over hundreds of miles is expensive

Contrast that with a nuke plant dedicated to making fuel. It could be situated in the middle of one of our larger military reservations out West (no nearby neighbors to complain). You could co-locate multiple 2GW reactors in one place (reducing planning, construction, and operation costs). You could use the waste heat as process heat for ethanol production and coal-to-gasoline conversion. Set up a big set of pipelines to transport the fuel to the rest of the country

[neverdem]

It seems to me government has distorted the whole bio fuel issue by offering subsidies. Now capital and other resources are pouring into something that only makes economic sense because of those subsidies. That isn’t the path to economic success... It pulls those resources from other ventures that would be economically positive. So this is burning resources unproductively costing us all.

You'll get no argument from me. Subsidized, corn derived ethanol doesn't appear to make economic sense. That nonsense needs to be stopped as soon as possible. I would only have subsidies for other methods until they also are proven to make no economic sense.

IMHO, with our fiat currency and current account deficit, we need energy independence as a national strategy, or we debase our currency and fund our adversaries.

[thackney]

I think hydrogen is where it`s at. 1 nuclear plant would would produce enough elect.to extract hydrogen from water to move us away from fossil fuels.Change your injectors fill your tank and away you go.

A gasoline or diesel engine will not run on hydrogen regardless of changing injectors.

[VOA]

RE: Earthrace boat

If the next “Bond Film” villain needs a boat...it’s already been built
and done it’s sea trials!

[Iwo Jima]

Hemp would seem to be perfect as a biofuel. We are the only country I know that stupidly outlaws hemp (as hard as it is to believe, some ignorant people think that it is the same as marijuana). Ron Paul has been trying to get hemp legalized for years.

[P-40]

But how certain are we of uranium reserves and what is their location?

[Iwo Jima]

Hemp. See my post #70.

[Iwo Jima]

What if you used hemp?

[P-40]

I would only have subsidies for other methods

If you were a major corporation, would you invest in other ways of making ethanol and other biofuels, and there are many, without some sort of signal from the government that they are here to stay? Tax credits, or subsidies if you prefer, are one signal that they are here to stay.

Or we can continue to trade our currency for foreign products.

[Iwo Jima]

What about hemp?

[P-40]

It makes a good biofuel...but try and get a lot of politicians to support its use.

[Hunterite]

What if you used hemp?

************************

Most of these fuels were known before America declared its independence from the British Empire. If they aren’t profitable, they aren’t profitable. Its as simple as that.

Hell even with the OPEC gangsters keeping supply artificially low, alternatives still can’t compete.

[Iwo Jima]

Well, isn't that just ignorance?< br>

If we could break our dependence on Middle Eastern oil, so many good things would result. We could tell those Arabic terrorists to go back to killing each other, cause we don't need anything they have to offer.

[Iwo Jima]

Hemp was profitable before the federal government made it illegal.

We won WWII using hemp ropes, tents, tarps, all types of canvas. It will grow just about anywhere -- after all it's a weed!

[P-40]

alternatives still can’t compete

What alternatives are you talking about? Some are doing quite well. Given that they have truly had only the last couple of years to prove themselves, I'd say they are doing quite well across the board.