Mitt Romney is a Mormon and I am a Baptist: Get Over It!

North Star Writers Group ^ | October 29, 2007 | Herman Cain

[Invisigoth]

The Baptists, Methodists, Catholics, Lutherans, Pentecostals, Mormons and a few other faiths have three things in common – they believe in Jesus Christ, that He is the Son of God and that He died and was resurrected for our sins.

So what’s the problem?

The political pundits continue to try and make Mitt Romney’s religious beliefs a big issue as he runs for the Republican presidential nomination. Different denominations of Christianity are just that – different denominations – which means different worship practices of the same fundamental Christian beliefs.

Some people have commented that they cannot support Mitt Romney because he is a Mormon. When they are pressed to explain why that is objectionable, they stutter. Still others are skeptical of Mitt Romney based solely on hearsay or lack of knowledge about Mormons.

[rodeo-mamma]

Whoever said that Christian’s have to believe in the Trinity? Before the 1970’s, that wasn’t even an issue, it was made an issue. By the same people who like to go around telling other Christians they aren’t Christian just because they go to a different Church. Most people that make a big issue out of those topics are usually not very spirtual and they often are very materialistic. So what do they know?

[rodeo-mamma]

I think it is wrong when people get into a debate over who and who is not Christian. In my opnion, the ones who like to be offensive and tell others they aren’t Christian these people are usually the last ones who would be Christian because they have the wrong focus. They obviously don’t think much about a personal relationship with Christ, because it is more important to feel self-rightous then to be pursuing something like that!

[rodeo-mamma]

I can’t stand it when people lie about the Mormons and say they don’t believe Jesus is the Son of God. It’s bad enough to be so judgemental, but then they have to go and add lying to it. It is very unappealing.

[ComeUpHigher]

Yes, Utah Girl is truly a lady when it comes to responding to the bile you post.

Unlike her, I’m not so diplomatic. I call it like it see it and your posting history reveals what you are—an anti-Mormon bigot.

Bigots never let facts get in their way. You make a pathetic attempt in your post to impugn BYU students as liberals who are supportive of Harry Reid when the FACTS couldn’t be more different.

BYU is ranked as the 4th most conservative college in the U.S. http://spotlight.encarta.msn.com/Features/encnet_Departments_College_default_article_10schoolsPoliticallyConservative08.html

And in 2005, Provo, Utah was ranked the most conservative city in the U.S. http://www.govpro.com/News/Article/31439/

But, as I have repeatedly seen from your posts, facts won’t get in the way of your repeated efforts to smear Mormons and any institution affiliated with them

[ComeUpHigher]

LOL. Colofornian—the John Kerry of evangelical Christians. If Romney is elected president, Colofornian can claim: “I was praying against him before I was praying for him.” That is just too funny.

[Grig]

NS should have access to both sides, but I figure why put you through the trouble of ignoring those things one more time.

[MHGinTN]

Perhaps the ‘plain and precious’ refers to the eight-hunred plus words Smith added at the end of Genesis chapter 50, where he fabricated a prophecy of his ‘coming in these latter days?’ Odd that he ‘translated’ into King James English a text already written in King James English. Actually, all he did was fabricate extra verses, even in The Book Of Revelations.

[broncobilly]

You simply posted a Biblical definition of the “gospel,” thinking it would be the magic “disarm” tactic...but in the process, you have deliberted distorted how LDS have added on to that definition in leaps & bounds...time to come clean

---

I think you are worked up about nothing. As a matter of fact. I gave you the correct precise definition of “gospel.” There is another definition. Mormons sometimes use the term “gospel” as synonymous with “religious truth.” One use is very specific and precise. The other is very general. One can easily tell by context which definition they are using.

About the plain and precious truths that were taken out of the Bible, I refer you to a book (not written by a Mormon) that discusses this. It was published by Oxford University Press. The title is “The Orthodox Corruption of Scripture: The Effect of the Early Christological Controversies on the Text of the New Testament.”
The author, Bart D. Ehrman, analyzes early manuscripts of the New Testament. He is able to piece together how the text was changed before it became canonized. What he found was that the many sects of early Christianity were competing to see which sect would win out and be recognized as THE one with the orthodox interpretation, and the sects altered the texts in the competing process. In the process of winning out, various passages of scripture were changed that would rule out the interpretation going to the competing sects. That is, the New Testament manuscripts were changed to suppress other sects. In retrospect, it would have been better if they had just let the earliest manuscript dictate what the canonized New Testament would say. But that didn’t happen. It was sort of like saying that the winner of a war gets to write the history of the war (with the corresponding biases.) It is fortunate that the Bible is as clear as it is, However the sect which became known as orthodoxy stacked the deck in their favor in some places.

[MHGinTN]

So did God fail to keep His Word that the gates of Hell would not prevail against His Church, His ekklesia, His called out ones? How many hundreds of millions do you Mormons feel you need to be baptised for inorder that the ones who've died over the past seventeen centuries may obtain Heaven? ... Whether you intend it to or not, your assertion seeks to sow doubt regarding the efficacy of the Bible and the ROCK upon which Jesus established His ekklesia, as if God is incapable of having in that text what He wants to bring the Gospel to humankind.

Your religion is founded upon the herectical notion that God's purposes were defeated for more than 1700 years and in need of 'restoring' the gospel through Joe Smith ... it certainly wasn't restored through the B of M since that novel agrees with the Bible in most respects, where the doctrines instituted by Joe and company contradict even the B of M!

This chartable list of contradictions is one of the main reasons why I happen to believe the B of M was at its core a novel penned by someone who was intimately acquainted with Jesus and the Gospel of Salvation by faith in His blood, and the subsequent fabrications by Smith show he was not so acquainted. In fact, his fabrications regarding the Egyptian papri and other fictions of his contrivance argue that he was not even able of his own abilities to write the B of M since he did such a poor job with his subsequent fabrications following the publishing of the B of M.

[dixiechick2000]

"I think it was Billy Graham who was asked why Baptist are so narrow minded as to believe that they were the only ones going to heaven. The response was that we are more narrow minded than that; we don’t think half of us are going to heaven."

That statement is proof alone that you don't know what you are talking about.
We believe that anyone who is Christian will go to heaven, no matter their denomination.

"Theological liberalism is destroying some of the mainstream protestant denominations. Southern Baptist churches can vary quite a bit in what they think you have to do to be a Christian."

I've never seen anyone who is less informed on Southern Baptists as you are.

We believe that anyone who is Christian, no matter the denomination, will go to heaven.

Southern Baptists don't vary one bit wrt being a Christian.

Why was this post allowed to stand?

This one has an agenda...and not a nice one.

Should he or she want to speak on the subject, why is he/she a drive by poster?

[dixiechick2000]

Sorry to bother the mods, but what you posted is an out and out lie.

I don’t know about your religion...but I am suspect of you.

After I post this, I’m going to hit the abuse button, something I rarely do.

You have an agenda, or you don’t know what you are talking about.

[dixiechick2000]

That’s true...but do you believe that Jesus is the Son of God, that he was sent to us to save us from our sins, and that he died on the cross for that effort?

Do you believe that He is the ONLY Son of God?

If so, that would make you a Christian.
If not...

[FastCoyote]

“I can think of no other way in which his Mormonism would be relevant in the Presidential primaries.”

Other than the fact that when founder Joseph Smith was running for president and tried to suppress the press (for among other things questioning his man-God proclivities and grifter ways) it led to a state of near civil-war and the eventual execution of Smith by a mob, who feared he was starting a theocracy complete with a secretive Danite society. Why other than that, polygamy, God on Kolob, blood atonement, secret handshakes and Temple rights, plus beliefs based on revelations and seer stones and Egyptian hieroglyphics, I can’t think of a single reason to wonder about the relevance of Mormonism to the stability of a presidential candidate.

[fproy2222]

You seem to be one of the people who think we as mormons should leave our church and join another.

Will you help me understand which of the many churches to join. Because of the conflicts of the many churches I studied, I had “non denominational” on my dog tags when I went into the armed service many years ago.

Would you give me some hints as to which churches teach the true gospel and which I should avoid?

[kalee]

I think you mean Arminianism. ;)

[DelphiUser]

I believe the acceptable practices for discussion here at FR is to confront the issues....

Just returning the ball the way it was served FRind.

And refrain from venting your personal attacks upon the holders of differing viewpoints...

Like you respected our different view points?, ROTFLOL!

Your insults are out of line...

So were yours, and yours were factually incorrect to boot.

The questionable origins of the Mormon doctrines, eternal world view, and ministry praxis are not aligned with plainly stated Biblical doctrine, nor the historical/grammatical disciplines of Biblical interpretation known collectively as hermeneutics.

The common interpretation of things is not always, or even often the right one. Jesus was a heretic according to the historical/grammatical disciplines of the Torah interpretation known collectively as hermeneutics of his day, so was he wrong?

The "secret" ceremonies of the "higher priesthood" are almost completely copied from Masonic rituals -- it's not even well-disguised plagiarism -- and it's not really a secret.

Oh stop, you guys always run to the temple ceremonies as a "Way to shut us up" you know we covenanted not to talk about it outside the temple.

The Holy Bible does not teach that Christians ( Mormons?) will someday be raptured to some other planet (Kolob?), And there have the opportunity to awaken one of their many wives, with whom to be united eternally...

Mormonism doesn't teach whatever it was you just said either.

As they then are blessed to serve as "gods" over other planets and populations.

Oh please, this is totally silly, you are so far wide of the mark it's funny. No one is going to be "placed" as a god over planets Jesus Created, he is God there.

Tell me, when your neighbor has kids does that make them your children's father? That is the kind of logic you are trying to say we use and it's just wrong, hence my comment about not knowing what you are talking about. It's like teaching calculus to a beginning Algebra student, you have most of the concepts wrong and others are entirely missing, yet you want to talk about Calculus, not Algebra, sigh your confusion is then inevitable.

Perhaps you have accepted such doctrines,
I expect we shall agree to disagree...

Certainly not what you eave described here, and I will not agree with you about what I don't believe.

LOL!, Nice editing. I Said: So, the fact that Mitt is the only front runner still married to his original wife carries Zero weight with you on the "how they live front"

You edited that to say: So, the fact that Mitt is the only front runner still married to his original wife carries Zero weight with you....

Conveniently leaving of the 'on the "how they live front"' which was a direct reference to the line I was responding to, here, let me quote to you from your post #42

What they believe and how they live out their doctrines of life will affect us all should they achieve an high office.

You see, only by creative editing can you say "I do not believe the original article -- nor my response to Mr Cain's article even mentioned Romney's marriage status... and certainly did NOT draw any comparison to other candidates in this area."

Disingenuous at best, and outright lie at worst, how can anyone trust you to tell the truth about my religion when you can't even keep the story straight on a thread here where it is easily checked?

Therefore, how would you PRESUME to know what perceptions of this candidate's married life do and don't carry weight with me??

Because you basically said so, no not directly, but anyone can go read your post #42 and see that that is the inference you were pretty heavy handed about it.

The only "polls" that are not front-loaded, not media-manipulated, and really count are the ones tallied in the voting booths during the primaries and in the general election next November. That is when people vote their convictions, their conscious, and the Constitution.

So, if I read your posts correctly, they boil down ti, Mitt can't win the primaries, and if he does, he will lose in the general, and if he doesn't do that then America is in big trouble because we have an {insert smear here} in office and that's bad.

I am also a Thompson supporter...

GREAT! Then why don't you just talk about how Mitt compares to Thompson on say health care, gun control, or border control, Talk about Mitt's position on gay marriage while Governor, how about his position on Abortion (there's even some nice video of that on you tube) there are plenty of legitimate things Fred Thompson can beat Mitt on, leave my religion out of it.

If Mitt becomes the Republican nominee...
I will support him and vote likewise....

Likewise, but it not much of a secret, that I think Fred Thompson is the better conservative, grin.

That makes my point-of-view at least as "relevant" as ....say your own?!!!

Precisely!

I strongly recommend you undertake to learn the basic etiquette of Free Republic.

Been there, had my religion dragged through the mud, been called names, I've even been "Damned to hell" a few times. When you start talking trash about my religion, the gloves come off, otherwise, I'm a pussycat. That is what I've learned from the people here who wanted to teach me the "etiquette" of how to behave on the topic of my religion.

You have a good one now, and let's win this for Fred above the Gutter, 'K?

[DelphiUser]

I Said: Tell me, if we did elect you president, would you violate the constitution to attack my church?

You said: OK. So now I'm the president-elect & I'm supposed to answer loaded questions like, "When do you beat your Mormon wife?" (or similar "nice assumption" types of question)

It was a simple question, the anti's on this forum keep saying that if Mitt is elected president he'll "Mormonize" the country, so I just wanted to know if you thought that because that is what you'd do. Just curious, that's all, but yours is an interesting non response.

You said: (Yeah. You got me. I've been a constitution-abuser from way back. I was on the wagon for a while; but my church stopped offering its UU mtgs [Upheaval Unanimous] for us prone to decompose the constitution...

Wow, you are reacting to this just like antis say we do, interesting.

You said: (I mean, I keep praying to a higher godhead power--you know, higher than our godhead...but every time I send an e-mail addressed to the "Highest Power of the Universe" I keep getting responses from various members of the "council of gods" saying "We have forwarded your request to our great grandfathers-godhead, who in turn passed it on to their great grandfathers-godhead." I finally got one divine council member who implied that there really was no original god or godhead, and that therefore my request will fall under their common "Catch-22" response--I can't get a response addressed to the "Highest Power of the Universe" unless I find him; But I can't find him because none of the gods know of him...alas, I can't find a single one who's not been "created.")

Three words, seek professional help.

According to Mormon doctrine There is no higher power over us than God the father. What ever you are smoking, it's out of date.

I'm my own grandpa

Many, many years ago, when I was twenty-three,
I was married to a widow who was pretty as can be.

This widow had a grown-up daughter who had hair of red.
my father fell in love with her, and soon they too were wed.

This made my dad my son-in-law and really changed my life,
now my daughter was my mother, cause she was my father's wife.

To complicate the matter, even though it brought me joy,
I soon became the father of a bouncing baby boy.

My little baby then became a brother-in-law to Dad,
and so became my uncle, though it made me very sad.

For if he was my uncle, then that also made him brother
of the widow's grown-up daughter, who, of course, was my stepmother.

Father's wife then had a son who kept him on the run,
and he became my grandchild, for he was my daughter's son.

My wife is now my mother's mother, and it makes me blue,
because, although she is my wife, she's my grandmother, too.

Now if my wife is my grandmother, then I'm her grandchild,
and every time I think of it, it nearly drives me wild,

cause now I have become the strangest case you ever saw
as husband of my grandmother, I am my own grandpa!

Oh, I'm my own grandpa.
I'm my own grandpa.
it sounds funny I know but it really is so,
oh, I'm my own grandpa

It may be funny as a song, but our doctrine just does not work that way. If you understood the doctrine, you'd know that, which is why I can say you obviously don't understand what you are talking about.

Click the link above to hear the music...

May Dad once told me "If you can't laugh at yourself, everyone else will."

[DelphiUser]

I would actually enjoy knowing that Colofornian, the anti-Mormon, anti-Romney basher, would be praying for the success of Romney—because that would be “good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour.”

Have you been borrowing tom CF's stash? (ain't gonna happen)

[DelphiUser]

WOW! Can I poish your shoes sometime? Well Said!

[DelphiUser]

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