Posted on 10/20/2007 2:08:12 PM PDT by Jim Robinson
"I speak for at least half the people here, including the Founder Jim Robinson, who has stated he will not vote for Giuliani under any circumstance."
Agree.
Don't Cut and Run, vote pro-life every time. It's the way you always win.
‘We cannot diminish the value of one category of human life — the unborn — without diminishing the value of all human life.’ —Ronald Reagan
As a Christian, I don't want to see this garbage (and yes, it is garbage, prideful garbage) on this board anymore.
There are people who believe they will be judged on the purity of their vote. There are people who believe they will be judged on the effect of their vote. I fail to see where you purists have any biblical backup for the idea that God is going to be hap-hap-happy when you use your vote in a way that ensures Hillary the God-hater will be sitting in the Oval Office. Now, I might be wrong about that, but then I don't go around telling people that God just happens to agree with my personal political strategies.
That behavior would be silly enough by itself, but to spew this stuff about murder onto a guy who was involved in just about the only abortion scenario that isn't a murder is just shameful.
Great! It will be a lot easier for a Republican liberal President to get Congressional Republicans to give him Pro-Choice, anti-gun, Pro-Gay agenda, big government legislation and judicial approvals.
A Dem would have to fight some Pubbie opposition.
Think mushroom cloud...
Yeah, just keep on pretending life’s going to be great when a blithering moron starts directing the war effort.
If Rudy is the nominee he will need a lot of damage control to stop the Clintons from taking the Whitehouse again.
I don’t think he’ll win, but if he loses it won’t be because I aided and abetted the Clinton crime family by throwing my vote away.
Reagan would never have been president if Ford had beaten Jimmy Carter in 1976. The Republic survived 4 years of Carter and as a result the Conservatives were able to elect a true conservative as president. History often repeats itself. If the republican party nominates Giuliani, I will sit out the election. I predict that Giuliani will lose and after 4 years of Hillary the country will be more than ready for a real conservative, like Ronald Reagan.
Frankly I fear a Giuliani presidency more than a Hillary presidency. If Giuliani is nominated, that means the end of conservatism in the Republican party. If he wins, then we will not be able to elect a real conservative for 16 to 20 years.
Now who’s talking from ego? Don’t bother yourself considering the logic or substance of what people are telling you. You just keep pretending you know what you’re talking about.
It will put the Republican Party on notice, that if they want their base to return, they must loft conservative candidates.
Then we can get down to the business of righting this ship of state. Otherwise we’re just going to stand by and watch Democrats move the nation far to the left while our side moves it a moderate amount to the left. Note, never to the right.
It must move to the right. I’m not going to vote for someone who doesn’t give a damn about the unborn or the sovereign status of this nation.
Neither would I. However, since He has not written in stone His choice, I will have to go with my values. He says, we shouldn't murder, I vote for someone who is pro-life.
I think you're designing your image of God around your ego.
I honestly try not to. I read the Scriptures and try to see things from His point of view. If both of the major-party candidates are pro-death, then I will not vote for either, as that is condoning sin.
I know--you aren't "condoning" sin by voting. Think about what your vote says, though. It says "I want this person, all his values, decisions, and leadership choices to be what this country is all about". I don't want this country to be about abortion.
And your entire basis for this is that it happened once before in the late '70s into 1980? That's a weak argument for saying that will happen again if Hillary is elected. The political landscape and important issues have changed dramatically since 1980. Also, who is this all important conservative that will rise up and restore the party if Hillary is elected? What you have is nothing more than dangerous wishful thinking.
Dangerous wishful thinking is holding to the idea that any Republican can beat Hillary without the help and fervent support of the religious right. We won't be there for Giuliani.
Okay, I'll try this again. Voting pro-life is not going to stop abortion in the USA. Even if there was no Roe. It would be a State issue and abortion would continue unabated by the millions.
If Jesus were to return tomorrow (Theology aside)and stand with a megaphone for all to hear, would he be shouting, get out there and VOTE PRO-LIFE! ?? Knowing that millions would continue to die?
At the great white throne judgement, will He say to you, Oh, I see you voted Pro-life, here is your crown! Good Job ??
I just don't see voting pro-life as something that should or will define our level of holiness before G-d.
Frankly, I think more is expected of us.
That's insane. A Giuliani election would be incredible damage to the party- Laying life to the side for a moment (as if), just electing a gun-grabber is enough to destroy the Republicans for years. A betrayal by the party of this magnitude will cause more than just the Christians to leave.
It is precisely "for the good of the country" that those of principle rise to deny the Republicans their folly. It is those self same principles that hold us together as a party, and as a people.
Observance of those principles, even those with which one may disagree or be neutral toward must be paramount, for each one lost is a separation. To suggest a path that will essentially rend the party asunder is not damage control, it is certain doom for all that we stand for and for all that we hold dear.
As a Christan first and foremost, I tend toward values as a prime concern. But I would never vote for a gun grabber regardless of how good the candidate might be on my issues. I would not do such a thing in deference to those of my fellows that hold 2A in primacy. I would not knowingly vote for a promise of tax increase, regardless of the reason, as that vote would harm my fellows who hold fiscal matters dear. The same for Constitutional issues, and etc... We have a responsibility to each other to uphold the intrinsic agreement that makes us whole as an entity. To do otherwise and expect the factions of this party to stick together is just simply ludicrous.
Without this party there is no defense at all. We may well be 'cutting off our nose to spite our face' as has been said on this thread, but that is better (in my mind) than cutting off both legs, an arm, and five fingers just to save face, that being the alternative we are asked to support.
A party so maimed cannot be made whole again, and cannot perform it's function, so it will have lost it's worth entirely. Those who would aspire to do so participate in their own peril, and should be ashamed of that complicity.
And what to you expect to accomplish by doing that? Do you think the Republican party will all of a sudden bow down to you. More likely you'll end up being treated like Ralph Nader's supporters were treated by the Democrats after 2000.
I think there is a huge difference between an abortion if the mother’s life is in danger versus on-demand anytime. Even the Church doesn’t disagree in such circumstances (one life isn’t more valuable than the other).
Just because it should be allowed select rare circumstances doesn’t mean we should endorse someone who supports casual abortions because they don’t want the responsibility.
That has nothing to do with my non-vote for a POS liberal if he's nominated as a Republican.
I guess you also took big naps from 1977-1981 and 1993-2001.
Yeah, and I'm still here. I'm not brainwashed with socialism.
RUDY'S NOMINATED = 3RD PARTY
But at the same time, it ruins the Republican party. If Hillary wins, Republicans act like Republicans and stand for conservatis and pro-life values. If Guiliani is elected it will redefine the party to the left. I don't want to see either get elected, that is why we need to fight now, instead of thinking about nightmare scenarios.
What Republican party?
More likely you'll end up being treated like Ralph Nader's supporters were treated by the Democrats after 2000.
I've got news for you... The Ralph Nader supporters currently RUN the Democratic Party. Remember Gore's running mate in that election? He was essentially kicked out of the Democrat party by the same lunatics who voted for Nader.
What is that supposed to mean? Unless you are somehow implying that there is no difference between the parties, which is an intellectually vapid argument. Look beyond whatever talking points you've got an actually analyze the information on your own.
I think the Nader analogy works very well in that Nader's supporters in the 2000 election where using the same argument that many on the far right are using now in that there is no difference between the parties. And for the record, Nader's supporters were demonized after the 2000 election once it was apparent that his efforts cost the Democrats Florida and thus the White House.
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