Posted on 07/16/2007 5:52:36 PM PDT by MosesKnows
July 14, 2007
By Seth McLaughlin
The first paragraph
Virginia Gov. Timothy M. Kaine has no plans to call a special General Assembly session to consider repealing new fees against bad drivers, despite public outrage, a potential lawsuit and a lawmaker's demand that he do so.
The last paragraph
The governor's office estimated the new law would affect only about 2 percent of Virginians.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...
I can’t understand people on this thread who buy the idea that only 2% of the people are affected. The law applies to every Virginia resident who drives. As a citizen of this state, I think it is outrageous. This is just a huge tax hike to raise revenue that could not otherwise be raised through the legislature.
Good point. There are many areas in Virginia that see a lot of out of state drivers: northern Virginia certainly sees a lot of DC and Maryland plates. Williamsburg would be another area that comes to mind. In addition, think of all the colleges in Virginia with out of state students. How fair is it if you have two college students in Virginia driving drunk or recklessly, the same circumstances for each, and one is punished more harshly because he or she is a state resident? I guess the out of state student can always respond that they’ll trade “civil remedial fines” for in state tuition any day....
Your college student example is an excellent point, as are the other areas you mention. I live just 8 miles from the MD line, even in the winter there are nearly as many out of state plates in the parking lot of the supermarket as there are in state.
There’s a major campground a few miles west of me on the Chesapeake and so I daily see the number of out of state plates. The intersection at the edge of my property sees accidents on a regular basis, and 9 times out of 10, at least one of the vehicles involved will have out of state plates.
They did the abuser fee instead of increasing the gas tax. They didn’t want to take the heat for increasing the tax on gasoline.
There IS another alternative. They could reduce spending in other areas. If roads are a priority, then by definition, other things are not as high a priority. With limited resources, then things that are not a high priority should not be funded. Yet, in spite of massive increases in revenue, the General Assembly could not manage to find enough money to deal with roads. Governor Gridlock and his RINO henchmen in the GA make me sick.
I think the fees “attach” to the driver’s license not the particular vehicle involved in the infraction. The way I understand it, the abuser fees are tied to the ‘points’ on your drivers license. So, if you were driving someone else’s car, you would deal with the abuser fees, not the owner of the car.
My bad, then. Did he change it based on legal advice or for some other reason?
I still think the only fair way to raise money for roads is through the gas tax. You drive a lot and put more stress on the roads, you pay more. And it doesn’t matter whether or not you live here. Reduce some other non-road tax in return.
It’s a bad law and trying to sell it based on the fact that only 2% of the population is affected is nonsense. The law applies to every resident of Virginia.
Hmm. Surprised I’ve never heard of that. Thanks.
That is where my confusion/question is arising. The “fees” are to be paid in the annual “installments” when you go to renew the plates on your car at DMV. If they are “attached” to your DL, when is the state going to collect them. My DL is not up for renewal until 2010, and I do not own a vehicle.
I am eagerly anticipating the first court challenge to this, I don’t think it is going to hold up.
For me personally this has no bearing, as I have no points on my DL and haven’t for many, many years. It’s the principle of it that has me up in arms.
I think it’s probably legitimate that he changed it for legal reasons. The reality is, he should have stricken it from the plan. But it’s what he’s called for since he came into office. He just managed to work things out so that the Republicans get the heat for “offering” this.
Bottom line is, it’s NOT NEEDED. They’ve been spending money like drunken sailors for years. What they need is fiscal accountability.
There was NEVER a budget crisis. Just over spending.
That’s a good question. Another reason why this law is an abomination.
meant to ping you to #50
Why shouldn't fines be heavy for shitty drivers? I live in Fayetteville NC the home of shitty drivers. I have almost been run over countless times, running red lights etc. Fines should be heavy to get those mo fos off the road. It is not a "right" to drive reckless.
That being said it should apply to anyone driving in Virginia.
What possible legal reasons? It doesn't make sense. Is it tied to vehicle registration, which appears the way they expect it to be paid, or to DLs? If it is tied to DLs, which it appears to because of points acrrued, it could easily be applied to those with out of state DLs. But if tied to vehicle registration, the included method of payment, it then becomes a tax only on a certain segment of the population, those who own vehicles.
Unlike non-smokers who are all for raising cigarette taxes, these fees do not personally concern me(no points on my DL and no vehicle registered in my name), yet I am still opposed to them.
Ok so next time you fail to signal you’re ok with a $1000 fine and a tax of $50 per point per year for the next 11 years all to “raise revenue” as stated in the passed law.
I think all of those concerns you raise are valid. And that’s why you’re right, it won’t hold up in court.
“I am eagerly anticipating the first court challenge to this, I don’t think it is going to hold up.”
I don’t think you can get a jury in traffic court. And I’m not sure if you can even appeal.
I really hope I’m right, I really do.
Why ever not?
The last time my husband got a traffic ticket he asked for and received a jury trial. His ticket was thrown out and both the cop and the prosecutor got chewed out by the judge. he was ticketed for running a red light, yet on the stand the cop admitted he had made a right turn on a yellow light, which is perfectly legal in Delaware, as is right turns on red lights.
Neither he nor I have ever been ticketed in Virginia, but I do not see why there would be no appeal process.
The difference might be that these are civil penalties, not fines. But I'm no legal expert.
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