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To: markomalley

A beautiful, and prayerful response.

But, Mark, there is another reason why the Church has not always been able to fulfill it’s responsibility to teach the real meaning of the Mass. After WWII, when so many vets returned and moved from the overcrowded cities to the suburbs, there was a distinct lack of churches waiting for them. And that includes Catholic schools. Many Catholics had to place their children in public schools, and the children had only one hour a week at religious training at the Catholic schools.

Catholic parents could, and many did, give good example to their offspring in their own daily lives, and by taking them to Mass every Sunday; making sure they received First Communion and Confirmation, etc. But the Catholic Church is so complex, that it wasn’t enough to counteract the prevailing post-WWII ‘60s.

I believe the change to English was to provide a sanctuary for those children where they could understand the meaning of Mass.

It was most unfortunate that the “new” Mass and the ‘60s coincided.

And, of course, the liberals took full advantage of the ‘60s, and the lack of Catholic schools. I have long equated the ‘60s with the Children’s Crusade where the children left home to find the holy grail, and were forever lost to their parents.

But, in my own lack of knowledge, I am unable to say what the Church could have done to save those children when the siren song of “Never trust anyone over 30,” and the lure of drugs and sex was so prevalent.

And some of those “lost” children have become priests. And now preach against the true teachings of the Church.

For my own part, I still believe that the English Mass has saved many of the otherwise “lost” youngsters. But the question remains, “How to reach and educate the rest who grew up in the sixties.”

Do you have EWTN on your radio where you live? It’s a very good start, not that you need it, and should be encouraged. And there are other groups presenting the Catholic viewpoint on radio and TV.

For the rest, we can only pray, and pray and pray for the full understanding of Catholic teaching. And I do fully, totally, and completely believe that the left will use any disagreement between those who want the Latin Mass and those who like the English Mass to try to futher divide the true Church. We must proceed carefully.


149 posted on 07/09/2007 9:34:51 AM PDT by kitkat (I refuse to let the DUers chase me off FR.)
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To: kitkat

These rebellious priests are still hippies. Only now they say, “Don’t trust anyone over 70” which of course includes our Holy Father. Still rebelling, still saying, “Rules were made to be broken,” and other assorted garbage. I was a hippie, too, so I know the drill.

I know some of the Protestant ministers never really had a calling, they just went to seminary as a way to dodge the draft. I would’t be surprised if the minister of the Presbyterian church I went to 25 years ago had done that. He never preached on the Bible readings for the day (or any Scripture passage at all). His sermons were always political and used to make me very angry. It’s hard when you leave church more angry and upset than when you came!


155 posted on 07/09/2007 10:19:32 AM PDT by nanetteclaret (Our Lady's Hat Society)
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To: kitkat

And not only that, he used to make up his own prayers and begin them with “Father, Mother God...” UGH!

At the time, I fled to the Episcopal Church, where all the prayers were in the Prayer Book. No weird prayers allowed! But since the ECUSA is in the process of sliding off the cliff, I’ve been safely within our Holy Mother Church for almost two years now.


156 posted on 07/09/2007 10:25:23 AM PDT by nanetteclaret (Our Lady's Hat Society)
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To: kitkat
After WWII, when so many vets returned and moved from the overcrowded cities to the suburbs, there was a distinct lack of churches waiting for them. And that includes Catholic schools. Many Catholics had to place their children in public schools, and the children had only one hour a week at religious training at the Catholic schools.

True, and when you consider that the prevailing culture had changed, all at once, into one that would be highly approved by Bacchus (that is, one that was focused exclusively on self). Move out to the suburbs, keep up with the Joneses, get the latest toys, give the kids everything that you didn't have as a kid, and so on. A tough thing for a culture of mysticism, self-sacrifice, and abandonment of self to God to compete with. Particularly when God's culture is only emphasized an hour a week.

I, honestly, don't have anything against the N.O. Mass in of itself. When it's celebrated properly, with the proper reverence and the proper theology being stressed. But the VCII reforms, all of them good...in of themselves...and the N.O. Mass...again, good...in of itself...were hijacked by those who started corrupting the youth with narcissism 10-15 years earlier.

For my own part, I still believe that the English Mass has saved many of the otherwise “lost” youngsters.

Perhaps. And bringing the Mass to the people is, again, not a bad thing. In of itself. And guitars are not a bad thing, either...in of themselves. See, I don't mind the cheap tunes from the OCP music book...in of themselves. It's the change in the theology as taught through the lyrics of those songs. Where the good thing is taken and twisted and weakened. You can have an offertory done to a folk song. Shoot, you can have an offertory done to a punk rock beat. But what do the lyrics say? What is the message that is inculcated to the people?

In fact, I would submit that, had they not weakened and cheapened the theology, the generation from the 60s (that first generation that had to survive post-war materialism) could have produced some tremendous mystics and some tremendous saints. But you know who had the mysticism? The so-called "New Age." Catholicism, as practiced according to the "spirit of VCII" (as opposed to "practiced according to VCII") was being twisted into a watered down protestant social gathering. So there was nothing real to cling to.

Do you have EWTN on your radio where you live? It’s a very good start, not that you need it, and should be encouraged. And there are other groups presenting the Catholic viewpoint on radio and TV.

Nope...the only Catholic radio around here is on the Internet. Such the pity.

163 posted on 07/09/2007 4:14:03 PM PDT by markomalley (Extra ecclesiam nulla salus)
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