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To: Zhangliqun
Red herring. Of COURSE

Jeez, is everything a "red herring" or "straw man" when you ask legitimate questions about faith? Hitchens was pointing to the fact that the same Christians that were marching with Jews and Buddhists also believe those Jews and Buddhists are going to Hell if they don't accept Jesus. Olasky's example proves nothing.

Even if they turned out to be wrong, the fact is they're actually trying to look out for you. But you somehow see it as them giving you the finger.

They're looking out for me by telling me that I have to believe as they do or I'm going to fry in Hell? That's got to be the worst sales pitch I've ever heard. Thanks but no thanks.

I don't get it.

If condemning 3 billion people in Asia to eternal damnation because they haven't converted to your religion makes sense to you, then I'm sure you never will get it.

66 posted on 06/22/2007 12:48:34 PM PDT by GunRunner (Come on Fred, how long are you going to wait?)
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To: GunRunner

You say: “If condemning 3 billion people in Asia to eternal damnation because they haven’t converted to your religion makes sense to you, then I’m sure you never will get it.”

Excellent point.

God’s message to mankind is NOT the peculiar theologies of the various creeds. It is the guidance on how we treat our fellow humans.

Those eager to announce that persons following different theologies are going to Hell want to believe they are members of a select club. Such a belief contradicts the concept of a wise and compassionate God.


83 posted on 06/22/2007 2:57:25 PM PDT by John Semmens
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To: GunRunner
Jeez, is everything a "red herring" or "straw man" when you ask legitimate questions about faith?

An irrelevant point is an irrelevant point whether you think the question is legitimate or not. Maybe you confuse Christian eschatology with hatred? Thinking someone is in danger and telling them so isn't hating them as you seem to be implying. Do rescue workers hate the people they are trying to rescue? (If they did, would they bother with the rescue?) Do the people who run AA meetings hate alcoholics?

You seem to be trying to ascribe to us a hate that just isn't there. That's why it's a red herring.

Hitchens was pointing to the fact that the same Christians that were marching with Jews and Buddhists also believe those Jews and Buddhists are going to Hell if they don't accept Jesus.

I understood exactly what Hitchens meant, I've heard this complaint over and over and over again. And my answer to that is SO WHAT?

If I as a Christian treat you well and am frequently -- as in said case of the Buddhists/Jews/Christians marching together -- willing to work with you on common ground, or maybe babysit your kids while you're gone, call the cops if I see someone burglarizing your home, take you in and clothe you and feed you when your house is destroyed by storm or earthquake, look after you when you're sick, etc., etc., why does it matter so much to you what I think will happen to you -- assuming all us theists are wrong -- after you cease to exist?

What kind of vanity is this that you require everyone to think that everything about you is wonderful and perfect -- even in your non-existent afterlife -- or you're permanently offended? If you're right, what we think about your future past the grave will have zero effect on you, so if we treat you well and show you love while you're here, what more can you ask? Why can't you and Mr. Hitchens just be secure in your own non-faith and just write us off as well-meaning eccentrics and love us anyway instead of freaking out over something you believe won't affect you anyway?

141 posted on 07/06/2007 9:56:22 AM PDT by Zhangliqun (The Blue and Gray had infinitely more in common than the Blue and Red. We're headed for Civil War.)
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