Secure
Our
Borders
or maybe The Alamo Party!
REMEMBER THE ALAMO!
RebelTex
Posted on 06/04/2007 12:04:48 AM PDT by Altura Ct.
What if this noble defeat starts to be seen as a glorious Mexican victory?
03:23 PM CDT on Sunday, June 3, 2007
Sometimes little things tell a big story. In a South Dallas classroom, a sweet-tempered Latino fourth-grader, the son of poor immigrants, told recent visitors about Santa Anna's historical greatness. He innocently explained why he found the Mexican general's victory at the Alamo to be – wait for it – inspiring.
I thought: We have just heard from the future.
According to the state demographer, by the time that fourth-grader is a father of schoolchildren, Texas will be a majority Hispanic state. Who wants to bet that a lot of Texans then will see the Alamo as this young boy does now? A Texas where most people view events at the Alamo – which constitute the central founding myth of Texas culture – not as a noble defeat, but as a glorious victory, would not be Texas as every generation since the founding has known it. And this is a big deal to a lot of people.
According to the state demographer, by the time that fourth-grader is a father of schoolchildren, Texas will be a majority Hispanic state. Who wants to bet that a lot of Texans then will see the Alamo as this young boy does now? A Texas where most people view events at the Alamo – which constitute the central founding myth of Texas culture – not as a noble defeat, but as a glorious victory, would not be Texas as every generation since the founding has known it. And this is a big deal to a lot of people
(Excerpt) Read more at dallasnews.com ...
Secure
Our
Borders
or maybe The Alamo Party!
REMEMBER THE ALAMO!
RebelTex
Great...I just spit out my last stick...
I guess thats why when I go to Mexico they call it “goma”, or some call “chicle’”...But that may be a general commercial term...
Great post.
outstanding recounting...many thanks
We once knew the meaning of treason.
Thanks.. interesting..
Thanks for the ping!
He as the CO-discoverer, not sole, if that makes you feel any better :)
His partner was some New York businessman I think.
Step 1; out-number the other guys 30 to 1.
States that once went Republican and even for Reagan, or had a shot to do so, have or are about to fall perpetually Dem in congressional and presidential elections.
You mean states like California where Reagan was elected governor?
I was thinking more of the tactics the Mexicans used.
I dont think the 30:1 numerical advantage was anything the Mexicans can take credit for. I mean it helps sure, but it wasn’t anything they planned.
The real question is why Travis got his command into such an unfavourable position.
Look at it this way...
If the battle of the Alamo had not occured, we may be speaking a different language in this part of the world...
And if the enemy (however superior the force is) notices you, and they spend some time with you...So much the better in my opinion if the purpose is to delay the opposition to allow the forming up of a force sufficient to defeat them on down the road...
Thats exactly what happened...
Would Travis and those guys in the Alamo liked reinforcements??? You betcha...But once they knew that was not likely, then the choice in my opinion was easy to make...Yes, it was a hard decision, yet easy to come by...And it was not fatalistic to do so either...
There have been many instances over the history of man of battles like this...And the outcome has always been tragic, but laudable because of what that sacrifice accomplished in the long run...
The story of the Alamo is portrayed as a “Noble defeat”, and certainly that is more true than the Mexican “glorious victory” theory. I understand your arguments, and have no problem with the conclusions you draw...yes it is often very neccesary that sacrifices are made for desirable results, and brave people throughout history have commonly made said sacrifices, to the benefit of us all.
The problem is, the Alamo doesn’t fit into this category very well.
Would you be speaking a different language if the Alamo had not occured?
No, you wouldn’t. Sam Houston saw to that.
Did the heroic sacrifice of the defenders of the Alamo (and heroic it very certainly was) delay the Mexican army substantially?
No it didn’t. What little time it did gain was entirely squandered by the politicos, who were violently squabbling amongst themselves. (At the time Houston had dissolved the Texas provisional government, while it had impeached him). Some things never change!
The Alamo does not cover the crossings from the Rio Grande or the invasion routes from Mexico at all. It is far too isolated. It is easily outflanked and it’s far too big to be properly defended by the number of troops available. And, contrary to popular belief, repeated in every film of the event, Houston actually gave Travis specific orders to abandon the place, blow it up, and retreat northwards. The letters are still in existence. So why did Travis deliberately disobey, and thereby get himself and his entire command surrounded and wiped out? As a military operation its of the same order as Custers last stand.
No one knows of course, as Travis didn’t survive the battle (in fact, according to many accounts he was the first of the defenders to be killed). He left his diaries and logs but they don’t give a very clear picture of his thinking. The most likely explanation is that Travis, who in defiance again of common belief was a relative newcomer to war, simply believed that the Alamo was more important strategially than it actually was.
Of course, these uncomfortable facts are not very inspiring, whichever way you look at it. And so the noble defeat was born, which of course, very much is.
I think we are both on the same page, your analysis covers some points I failed to make...
Yes, the knucklehead politicos did waste some time in their deliberations that cost some lives...
In any event the end results speak for themselves...Either that was political/military/personal luck, or savvy planning...Maybe it was a combination of the two conditions...
I believe it was a lot of luck, that smart people capitalized upon...
I believe Sam Houston was prepared to see what San Jacinto was going to end up as, and that he obvously had a plan of fallback positions to nit pick Santa Ana’s forces down and let logistics come into play to wear the Mexicans down even further...
I believe there was some talk in the U.S. to come in and intercede on the behalf of the Texian cause during this campaign...And Sam Houston most likely planned to draw the conflict out and hope the U.S. would come in and help out...Thats if San Jacinto had not gone off as well as it did...
Some of Sam Houston’s later writings illuded to that line of thought...
You do recall that the Alamo was the most cannon’d fort in that part of the equation, right???
To me it might have almost been more militarily prudent to bypass that stronghold, and campaign through the rest of Texas until you just had to go after it...
I believe the Alamo was a vanity cause for Santa Anna...He was just compelled to get in there and take care of it like he did...I suppose he didn’t expect it to stub his toe as much as it did...
Hindsight is 20/20, right???
Inasmuch as the Mexican general who had been ousted from San Antonio by the defenders of the Alamo was none other than his brother-in-law, yes there was quite a bit of compulsion to settle accounts...
the infowarrior
Yep...I guess it just goes to show, most B.I.L. relationships transend logic...
You are right, I forgot that bit of irony in the timeline...
Motivation for conducting this campaign could be linked “in part” to pride...I’d buy it...
The best vision you can have is 20:20 hindsight :)
Splendid account and synopsis of the life of Santa Ana. He has many counterparts in the U.S. Government today— Ted Kennedy, Harry Reid and, unfortunately, George Bush.
Step 2: accept 4-1 casualty ratio as the cost of doing business.
IIRC, they took about 700 casualties, for the 185 they inflicted.
STILL lost the freaking war.
Feel free to laugh.
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