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Fox reporting one snow climber found (Deceased)

Posted on 12/17/2006 3:43:18 PM PST by ConservativeMan55

One climber found dead on Mt. Hood


TOPICS: News/Current Events; US: Oregon
KEYWORDS: climber; kellyjames; mountaineering; mounthood; mthood; oregon
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To: angkor

I agree with you said generally, but Kili can be trekked.


321 posted on 12/18/2006 7:15:33 AM PST by palmer (Money problems do not come from a lack of money, but from living an excessive, unrealistic lifestyle)
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To: ConservativeMan55

The only acceptable answer to the thread is: God help this poor man's family.

The debate whether we should pay for a rescue or not, is crass, anti-christian, and inhuman.


322 posted on 12/18/2006 7:18:16 AM PST by aristotleman
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To: Dog Gone

"unless everyone understands, including the climbers, that no rescue attempt will be made. "

Are you truly not understanding what I said?

Mountain rescue teams are 100 percent private non-profit organizations, many formed decades ago and long before any state, local, or federal agency was even remotely involved in mountain rescue and SAR.

They will continue to aid fellow climbers regardless of public agency involvement, just as they've always done, with or without the "coordination" functions of Oregon county sheriffs, with or without Chinooks.

What you're not understanding, I think, is that mountain rescue teams don't rely on public funds. So you can't really "defund" them. They'll continue to be funded by private donations and volunteer efforts, and they will continue to aid fellow climbers in distress. Just as they always have done.


323 posted on 12/18/2006 7:22:13 AM PST by angkor
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To: angkor
That's less than 1 cent per taxpayer. One penny. To be more precise, 0.75 cents per year.

Your assuption of equal costs is invalid. The top 1% of taxpayers pay 38% of the taxes the top 10% pay 68% of the taxes. SO if you're assuming 100,000,000 taxpayers then the top 1% pay $.28 cents, not $.0075 All of which is irrelevant anyway -

What is relevant is that people should be charged for the taxpayer provided services and by all means charge the hikers too. Mountain climbing is inherently risky, and if you want to do it, then accept the consequences including paying for an SAR efforts. You don't get free stamps at the post office, why get free government sponsored SAR activites (and if volunteers want to do this then more power to them).

324 posted on 12/18/2006 7:24:08 AM PST by from occupied ga (Your most dangerous enemy is your own government)
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To: palmer

"Kili can be trekked."

If you're saying it's a less technical climb, I agree, from everything I've heard and read.

But it's still one of the 7 Summits, and people do fail on it.


325 posted on 12/18/2006 7:25:38 AM PST by angkor
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To: angkor

My friend did it and he is not a technical climber. But regardless of the technicality it is a very demanding climb, a couple people in his group couldn't make it to the peak.


326 posted on 12/18/2006 7:28:16 AM PST by palmer (Money problems do not come from a lack of money, but from living an excessive, unrealistic lifestyle)
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To: angkor
It is very surprising to me, coming from another country, to see that certain people in your society would let their fellow citizens die on top of a mountain, because they think that their risk-taking is a factor in the decision to rescue them.

In western civilization, we value all life. My ancestors taught me democracy, and love for your neighbor.

I'm just shaking my head.

I understand that part of conservative values is self-responsibility (which is what has attracted me to this group), but this just takes it too far!

Those men need to be rescued merely because they are our neighbors, and God's children. End of story.
327 posted on 12/18/2006 7:28:35 AM PST by aristotleman
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To: from occupied ga

"the top 1% pay $.28 cents, not $.0075 All of which is irrelevant anyway -"

OK, whatever.

I say completely remove climbing SAR efforts from the public domain.

Mountain rescue will still do what it's always done.

And then we won't hear the keening and moaning over 28 cents.


328 posted on 12/18/2006 7:29:51 AM PST by angkor
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To: cerberus
I am tired of all the judgemental couch potatoes who sit around clucking like a bunch of hens.

Amen. (And my second favorite comment to the insensitives.)

329 posted on 12/18/2006 7:29:57 AM PST by proud_2_B_texasgal
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To: palmer

"he is not a technical climber. But regardless of the technicality it is a very demanding climb"

I think we're both agreeing here.


330 posted on 12/18/2006 7:30:45 AM PST by angkor
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To: angkor
Can't you comprehend what I wrote?

I comprehend it, I just don't believe it. I find it impossible to believe that evey resource used in looking for these guys was at no cost to the taxpayers. I saw footage of helos searching, and I know that these are not privately owned and flown by volunteers who purchased them for SAR activities.

331 posted on 12/18/2006 7:31:17 AM PST by from occupied ga (Your most dangerous enemy is your own government)
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To: aristotleman

"The debate whether we should pay for a rescue or not, is crass, anti-christian, and inhuman."

Continue reading if you can stomach it.

The ghouls are out in force here.


332 posted on 12/18/2006 7:31:46 AM PST by angkor
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To: from occupied ga
That's less than 1 cent per taxpayer. One penny. To be more precise, 0.75 cents per year.

Ya know? I don't give a rat's rear if it's 1 millionth of a penny. It belongs to me and I don't wish to spend it supporting stupid behavior.

Just one more of the thousands of pet programs forced upon us by progressives that couldn't afford to do their idiotic BS without OUR MONEY!!!

333 posted on 12/18/2006 7:32:07 AM PST by EndWelfareToday (Live free and keep what you earn.)
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To: angkor
I say completely remove climbing SAR efforts from the public domain.

I agree - what the heck are we arguing about then?

334 posted on 12/18/2006 7:32:15 AM PST by from occupied ga (Your most dangerous enemy is your own government)
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To: aristotleman

"I understand that part of conservative values is self-responsibility (which is what has attracted me to this group), but this just takes it too far!"

These people are not really conservatives.

They're heartless and sterile ghouls.


335 posted on 12/18/2006 7:32:50 AM PST by angkor
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To: EndWelfareToday
Ya know? I don't give a rat's rear if it's 1 millionth of a penny. It belongs to me and I don't wish to spend it supporting stupid behavior.

I believe that was the viewpoint I was espousing. It was angkor who thought that it wasn't a problem.

336 posted on 12/18/2006 7:33:34 AM PST by from occupied ga (Your most dangerous enemy is your own government)
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To: angkor

Winter is the dry season in Florida also. Monsoon begins mid-june and lasts through August - typically.


337 posted on 12/18/2006 7:34:35 AM PST by Sunnyflorida ((Elections Matter)
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To: angkor

Shame on all of those people.


338 posted on 12/18/2006 7:36:42 AM PST by aristotleman
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To: Sunnyflorida; angkor
Perfect time to tackle Britton Hill
339 posted on 12/18/2006 7:39:02 AM PST by palmer (Money problems do not come from a lack of money, but from living an excessive, unrealistic lifestyle)
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To: angkor

Where did I say anything about defunding anyone? I didn't.

Where did I say anything about trying to prevent rescue attempts? I didn't.

My comment was entirely directed at what expectations climbers should have. We're not on opposite sides on this question, but you continue to insist that we are.

I would switch to crayon font if I knew how. My point was nothing more than a statement that IF we (whomever WE is) decide not to attempt rescues, and the climbers know that no rescues will be attempted, then that's one path we could take, but everyone should understand that up front.

Otherwise, there is an expectation that rescue attempts will occur.

If you don't understand what I was saying, just forget it. I think the rest of the folks did.


340 posted on 12/18/2006 7:40:53 AM PST by Dog Gone
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