Posted on 11/17/2006 10:46:11 AM PST by TheKidster
GOLDEN, Colo. -- A judge has upheld a homeowners association's order barring a couple from smoking in the town house they own.
Colleen and Rodger Sauve, both smokers, filed a lawsuit in March after their condominium association amended its bylaws last December to prohibit smoking.
"We argued that the HOA was not being reasonable in restricting smoking in our own unit, nowhere on the premises, not in the parking lot or on our patio," Colleen Sauve said. The Heritage Hills #1 Condominium Owners Association was responding to complaints from the Sauves' neighbors who said cigarette smoke was seeping into their units, representing a nuisance to others in the building.
In a Nov. 7 ruling, Jefferson County District Judge Lily Oeffler ruled the association can keep the couple from smoking in their own home.
Oeffler stated "smoke and/or smoke smell" is not contained to one area and that smoke smell "constitutes a nuisance." She noted that under condo declarations, nuisances are not allowed.
The couple now has to light up on the street in front of their condominium building.
"I think it's ridiculous. If there's another blizzard, I'm going to be having to stand out on the street, smoking a cigarette," said Colleen Suave.
For five years the couple has smoked in their living room and that had neighbors fuming.
"At times, it smells like someone is sitting in the room with you, smoking. So yes, it's very heavy," said condo owner Christine Shedron.
The Sauves said they have tried to seal their unit. One tenant spent thousands of dollars trying to minimize the odor.
"We got complaints and we felt like it was necessary to protect our tenants and our investment," said Shedron.
The Suaves said they would like to appeal the judge's ruling but are unsure if they have the money to continue fighting. They said what goes on behind their closed doors shouldn't be other people's business.
"I don't understand. If I was here and I was doing a lawful act in my home when they got here, why can they say, 'OK, now you have to change,'" said Colleen Suave. "We're not arguing the right to smoke as much as we're arguing the right to privacy in our home."
Other homeowners believe, as with loud music, that the rights of a community trump the rights of individual residents. The HOA is also concerned that tenants will sue those homeowners for exposure to second-hand smoke and this could be a liability issue.
The couple said that they would like to unload their condo and get out of the HOA entirely, but they are not sure if the real estate market is right.
Of dancing on a deck?
Totally non-carcinogenic, it is a potent oxidizer and a mild lung irritant.
When are you going to get the government to ban cars? They kill tens of thousands and befoul our air?
When are you going to restart prohibition?
YOUR PERCEIVED RIGHT TO A CONVENIENT, COMFORTABLE LIFE IS NOT A RIGHT!
spouses of heavy smokers who now have Bronchogenic carcinoma
Taking your mindset about this particular HOA rule and the court ruling you should realize those spouses agreed to a smoking spouse before hand! If they didn't like it and if it was harmful they were always free to choose to leave, right??
Get over yourself, you do not have a right to not be inconvenienced.
Betcha if we made lab rats breathe pure O3 for months on end, something bad would happen. Quick! Call Superfund for a toxic clean up!
Sure. And a hot sunlit day is non-warming.
It is shallow to work hard, to want a nice house in a nice neighborhood. It is shallow to agree to common rules for living in a neighborhood. It is shallow to be a person who wants the old American dream. Getting rich is shallow to you?
Dude, the chip on your shoulder tells me you have given up on it.
Ok now you just sound like an idiot. It's shallow to believe you are better because you have more wealth.
That's what I've been saying.
Simply getting rich is NOT the American dream. If it were drug dealers and Kenneth Lay wouldn't be despised.
The American Dream is to live in a FREE land where everyone has the equal opportunity to work hard and acheive the type of life they dream of. If that involves being rich, great! More importantly it involves the ability to pursue liberty and happiness, and to let other people do the same, even if it presents a minor inconvenience to you.
This may be a new concept to you (along with common sense, and grace) but wealth doesn't determine your value as a person. I know, it's a wild thought isn't it!!
My dear lady {this is sort of fun!}, your right to smoke is absolutely yours. My right to breathe is mine.
Surely you do not think you have the right to share your decision to smoke with me?
The person intolerant of others is the smoker who wants to make another breathe his smoke. Why should anyone tolerate that.
ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!
Again, you are exaggerating and distorting my position.
I have never said I want to be "never" offended. I simply allow by choice a HOA to enforce commonly agreed upon rules. I have gained the liberty of not worrying aboutmy neighborhood deteriorating by my agreement. I don't break the rules by choice.
I think you are getting overwrought.
You ignore the points I have made at your own peril.
Dislike smoking all you wish, but remember one thing, this will not stop with smoking.
Still, you know that the HOA can change the rules. What an HOA can't do however is force a non-signatory to comply. IE, an HOA cannot form and compell existing home owners to comply. When you buy property with an HOA overlord, it's your own fault.
Get outside yourself and into a physics book.
There's nothing wrong with civilized people agreeing to a common set of rules.
What people have a problem with is that these HOA's can be co-opted by people who abuse the power to settle personal vendettas, forclose on people's homes to eliminate a minor inconvenience, and frequently change the rules of the game artbitrarily or specifically to oust a percieved enemy. You may not have been on the wrong end of a HOA but many on here have, and it wasn't because they violated rules they agreed to.
I have been off this site for two days while we have been busy with my daughter's newborn son, and I came back today just to see what the mice were up to - I'm sorta sorry I bothered.
I have been off this site for two days while we have been busy with my daughter's newborn son, and I came back today just to see what the mice were up to - I'm sorta sorry I bothered.
i'm thinking we'll pass on that green paint ;)
Poor old Gabz; makes herself such an inviting target.
How far does your nose extend?
Stay off my property, out of my house, out of my business. Then you need never breathe my smoke.
BTW, keep you car out of my town, out of my state, out of my country - then I need never breathe yours.
Long-standing challenge - I will go in the garage, and chain-smoke.
You go in the garage, and let your car idle.
Last one breathing, wins.
My bed is just fine.
I am perplexed that people agree to covenants, buy a condo, can read I assume, have no problems with the idea that a community has agreed upon standards and that is offensive to others. I am perplexed that others feel like they are offended by it and insult people who choose to live in a place with HOA/s and demand that they be outraged.
Some of us are not outraged, feel liberated from worrying about having to sue others, move, etc when a neighbor violates community standards.
But some here really want to impose their sense of outrage. I say they don't have to live my way and I don't have to live their way. They distort that idea and declare only they are defending liberty. The only liberty they defend is their right to do whatever they want, whenever they want and demand that others adapt to them. That is just bullying if you ask me.
But my bed is just dandy.
Of course they did. Those civilized people also didn't insist that the world cater to thier personal whims and preferences.
You sound self absorbed and conceited. That is the problem with our country, you miopic belief that the world is here to serve you and its inhabitants are here to make sure, above all else, that life is as easy and convenient for you.
It's pointless to continue this with you, i think i might be offending you. i don't want to commit a cardinal sin by making life slightly uncomfortable for you, my queen.
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