[stevem]

My wife and I saw it today. We also took my Dad who was a pharmacists mate (Navy Corpsman) who invaded Iwo Jima on D-Day and Okinawa (also) on D-Day.

First, I liked the movie. I thought the depictions of the mayhem of the invasion were quite realistic. My Dad said they were, as well. He said he also remembers how hard it was to hear anything in the din, although he never thought about that in all the years since then until we saw the movie.

Second, I was apprehensive about seeing it because I thought the war bond drive portion could degenerate into a soap opera which is a shame since the story of the invasion is such a great story on its own. After seeing it I thought they could have spent more time on Iwo and less on the bond drive.

I understand you can't do 2.5 hours in just the din of battle. That would have lost most the viewers. Still, the bond drive I thought could have been more of an interlude to give the viewers a rest from time to time. Clint did a good job of showing what filthy slime were politicians in those days as they are today. The flash backs within flash backs didn't harm the movie for me. The way it was written, that made sense.

I'm sure I'll think of more things as time goes by, but here are some impressions:

Quintessential Eastwood (in these sensitive times): The Sailors and Marines did seem to enjoy a good smoke.

The audience was mostly older folks. I was among the youngest there. I'm going to be 55 next month. My guess is the vast majority of the population never heard of Iwo Jima, as it doesn't make the radar screen among the young folk.

Unusual item: When the movie ended, the exit theme was marvelously understated. During the theme and credits, there were many pictures of the real battle flashed on the screen. While they were flashing these pictures, no one in the theater moved. We all just sat there and looked at those pictures. I think it lasted several minutes, maybe five or so.

I knew the story of Ira Hayes long ago. I remember an ancient Johnny Cash song that told the tragic story. I didn't need to see it today, so anyone can have my part of it...again...too much focus on the bond drive.

Other than my Dad, I've met two other men in my life that participated in that invasion. With but one or two questions, I have never...NEVER...had the least bit of difficulty getting these guys to tell their story.

I also once sought out and spoke to a sailor on the Yorktown in the Battle of Midway. This guy just loved telling me his story.

I have worked with and personally known guys in battle in Vietnam. I have never...NEVER...had the least difficulty in getting these guys to tell their stories. (I grew up with one guy that went to Vietnam and returned a head case ala Ira Hayes. He was the only one I ever met that did so.)

I think the axiom of ex-military never wanting to talk about war experiences is a bunch of drivel. Just an opinion.

I do rememeber asking my dad when I was a teen how guys can keep pushing forward when guys around them are getting blown to bits. He told me long before I ever heard anyone else say it that in that kind of struggle guys fight for the guys around them, no more, no less.

Disclaimer: I was Navy and never involved in any battles so all of my battle genre experiences have been vicarious.

[hardworking]

Re war stories: (1) Friend of my parents was a medic in WWII and he wouldn't talk about it. (2) Another family friend was on a ship in the Pacific that was sunk - he always told the story of his two buddies - one couldn't swim - said the oil in the water was on fire and when a life raft appeared the guy who couldn't swim managed to beat the other two to the raft (3) My Mum's love of her life (no, not my father) was on the ship that sank and the men attacked by sharks - don't think she ever really got over that loss all the way to age 80 when she passed.

[skepsel]

I talked to lots of German vets of WWII and noticed the same thing, once they knew we were GIs and not peaceniks, actually interested in hearing their stories, they were more than willing to talk. Funny thing tho' everybody fought the Russians, no one ever fought Americans (wink).

One guy got a little loaded and remarked next time would be better, they had good allies this time, the Americans and British!

[ansel12]

"With but one or two questions, I have never...NEVER...had the least bit of difficulty getting these guys to tell their story."



You are correct, vets will talk but not to just anybody. Even in my own family with a dad with a huge amount of kids and several families the most anybody else knew was that he was in the navy, but I talked to him a lot about his WWII experiences from 1939 to 1945 and his bloody service in the Pacific including serving on the USS Marble head when it became known as the Ghost ship after surviving the battle of the Java sea and disappearing after it was thought to be sank.

All over the country I've had combats vets relieved to tell me their stories, I think you have to be sincerely interested in them as an individual, you need to know some history of their unit and their battles, and it helps to be a serious type veteran yourself.

If you are truly interested in people, people will tell you anything, especially the most dear things, that no one else in their life is suited to hear or even to listen to.

[VOA]

I think the axiom of ex-military never wanting to talk about war experiences
is a bunch of drivel. Just an opinion.

I think there's been a bit of a society shift on this, or else a change
in some of the military personnel.

In the town I grew up in it wasn't until the time of the first Gulf War
that it was widely revealed that an old fellow at my church (retired
postman) was a survivor of four combat jumps in Europe.
And that a fellow that ran a downtown mens clothing store had
been a very young B-17 pilot.

At least for those two guys, AFAIK, they were mum about their WWII
service until almost 50 years after the fact.

[PhatHead]

Thanks for your review - okay mostly thanks because you confirm my biases regarding Clint Eastwood, and I look forward to seeing the movie. I also appreciate your dad's commentary, which matches the "only fighting for my buddies" theme. I have heard that from combat vets, too. Not to trivialize combat, but don't we hear the same sort of thing from professional athletes, too? They are playing for their team-mates, not for the Super Bowl, etc? It is human (male) nature.

I think the axiom of ex-military never wanting to talk about war experiences is a bunch of drivel. Just an opinion.

There is some truth to it, but it is exaggerated. My uncle served two years in Marine recon in Vietnam and really never talks about it. But I served with a lot of guys, and have met many more who are glad to share their stories. Even my uncle's reticence has more to do, I think, with the fact that most people would not "get it" than with personal trauma preventing him from speaking.

[Tammy8]

I have been around a lot of military men too; several in my family and many friends- I have never noticed the lack of talk as you say, at least around those they are comfortable with. I will say I do notice if they think someone can't relate to what they are saying or isn't really interested they will clam up pretty good. I know hubby is funny that way- he talks pretty freely about his experiences but if someone says something like "so tell me what it was really like in Vietnam" or makes a dumb remark and you can tell they are insincere he will blow them off with some smart-a$$ comment.

[Bender2]

Re: "I knew the story of Ira Hayes long ago. I remember an ancient Johnny Cash song that told the tragic story."

Ira Hayes,
Ira Hayes

CHORUS:
Call him drunken Ira Hayes
He won't answer anymore
Not the whiskey drinkin' Indian
Nor the Marine that went to war

Gather round me people there's a story I would tell
About a brave young Indian you should remember well
From the land of the Pima Indian
A proud and noble band
Who farmed the Phoenix valley in Arizona land

Down the ditches for a thousand years
The water grew Ira's peoples' crops
'Till the white man stole the water rights
And the sparklin' water stopped

Now Ira's folks were hungry
And their land grew crops of weeds
When war came, Ira volunteered
And forgot the white man's greed

CHORUS:
Call him drunken Ira Hayes
He won't answer anymore
Not the whiskey drinkin' Indian
Nor the Marine that went to war


There they battled up Iwo Jima's hill,
Two hundred and fifty men
But only twenty-seven lived to walk back down again

And when the fight was over
And when Old Glory raised
Among the men who held it high
Was the Indian, Ira Hayes

CHORUS:
Call him drunken Ira Hayes
He won't answer anymore
Not the whiskey drinkin' Indian
Nor the Marine that went to war

Ira returned a hero
Celebrated through the land
He was wined and speeched and honored;
Everybody shook his hand

But he was just a Pima Indian
No water, no crops, no chance
At home nobody cared what Ira'd done
And when did the Indians dance

CHORUS:
Call him drunken Ira Hayes
He won't answer anymore
Not the whiskey drinkin' Indian
Nor the Marine that went to war

Then Ira started drinkin' hard;
Jail was often his home
They'd let him raise the flag and lower it
like you'd throw a dog a bone!

He died drunk one mornin'
Alone in the land he fought to save
Two inches of water in a lonely ditch
Was a grave for Ira Hayes

CHORUS:
Call him drunken Ira Hayes
He won't answer anymore
Not the whiskey drinkin' Indian
Nor the Marine that went to war

Yeah, call him drunken Ira Hayes
But his land is just as dry
And his ghost is lyin' thirsty
In the ditch where Ira died

Call him drunken Ira Hayes
He won't answer anymore
Not the whiskey drinkin' Indian
Nor the Marine that went to war

I hate it when I can't sleep....

[Steel Wolf]

I think the axiom of ex-military never wanting to talk about war experiences is a bunch of drivel. Just an opinion.

I think it greatly depends on the people involved.

Most people will talk about it, to some degree, depending on how comfortable they are with the person asking. It's the level of detail that people vary on. This is especially true in relation to the event itself. Some people never relate the full story, and relay a sanitized version of events. Others get fixated on the negative, and can't get past them.

All in all, it's hard to judge, unless you were there. When you hear your buddies talk, or catch yourself talking, you get a sense of what other veterans are saying. And, in many cases, not saying.

[condi2008]

...I thought the war bond drive portion could degenerate into a soap opera...

That's what I'm expecting, too.

After seeing it I thought they could have spent more time on Iwo and less on the bond drive. I understand you can't do 2.5 hours in just the din of battle. That would have lost most the viewers.

After reading the book, I think one could easily fill 2.5 hrs. with the flag-raisers' stories leading up to the war; the battle itself (not just D-Day + flag-raising); & then 15 minutes or so of aftermath...

[TeleStraightShooter]

Unusual item: When the movie ended, the exit theme was marvelously understated. During the theme and credits, there were many pictures of the real battle flashed on the screen. While they were flashing these pictures, no one in the theater moved. We all just sat there and looked at those pictures. I think it lasted several minutes, maybe five or so.

I was struck by that too.
People froze in the aisles, as if they were afraid of dishonoring the men who sacrificed so much for us.

[driftless2]

I didn't like "Flags" but you're comment about Vietnam vets is correct. I've got an older brother who is one, with a lot of battle decorations, and I've known and worked with a lot of vets who were in battle. None of them are head cases in fact most of them are saner and more productive than the non-Vietnam vets or non military vets from that era that I know.