Posted on 06/10/2006 9:45:53 PM PDT by churchillbuff
Despite lifelong beliefs that have been ingrained in my faith since childhood, I have to admit that like almost everyone else I have from time to time wondered if my existence will simply come to an end on the day I draw my last breath.
There is, after all, no way to prove one way or the other that human life continues in another realm after the body ceases to function. Nobody has come back to testify about it, with one notable exception of course, and those who reject his divinity also tend to doubt what he had to say about life after death. And the late Madalyn Murray O’Hair, the infamous atheist, hasn’t weighed in on the subject lately either.
Some would insist such doubts are implanted by the devil himself. Others counter there is no scientific basis for belief in a hereafter in the first place.
But just about every time I entertain such doubts, something comes along to reinforce my long-held belief in the hereafter. It’s often the experience of a dying saint getting their first glimpse, as an old gospel song puts it, of what’s over on the other side.
I’m told the Rev. Dr. Hollis Pistole appeared to have one such experience at his passing a little over a month ago. According to the story, Dr. Pistole, after a long battle with debilitating illness, raised up and put his arms out just before he drew his last breath. Apparently he received that glimpse of what awaited him.
My wife’s father had a similar experience, opening his eyes and reaching heavenward just before his passing.
I also recently went over my mom’s notes made at the time of my dad’s death more than half a century ago. “Under me? Under me? Thank you, Jesus,” he said.
A whole category of what have been termed near-death experiences have been catalogued by those looking for insight into what happens at the end of life. A common phenomenon is a light-at-the-end-of-a-tunnel vision. Many claim to have seen friends or relatives but were unable to reunite with them when they were suddenly jerked back into life.
My Uncle Melvin had such an experience, claiming to have seen his brother and another loved one at the time he was suffering a severe heart attack from which he recovered.
It is impossible to figure out the working of the subconscious, thus rendering any attempt at concrete conclusions problematic. Are any or all of these phenomena merely the gyrations of an active brain or might they be an indication of a link between this world and one to come?
Belief in life after death has been part of human experience as long as mankind has pondered its existence. It has been reinforced by the most sacred writings of most of the world’s major religions, including Christianity, which bases its entire concept on the idea of God personally demonstrating life after physical death through the manifestation we call Jesus.
In this life, of course, our existence is tied to our physical body. But to define human life according to our physical limitations is an obvious understatement of our role in the universe. Human interaction is limited by our physical senses. But the true self that has developed over the course of our lifetimes would seem to go far beyond the senses.
And certainly there can be no doubt that the rationality of human beings and their capability to build on their life experiences place them in a category entirely separate from other living creatures.
Is there life after death? The question defies physical proof, to be sure. But there would seem to be glimpses enough into the future to show that our existence has only just begun.
And anyway, by preparing for eternity, I think I’m building a pretty good life here as well.
Jim Bailey’s column appears on Sunday. He can be reached by e-mail at jameshenrybailey@earthlink.net.
Yeah, I know what you mean, waiting rooms really piss me off. I mean, there ya are, sittin' next to some Zulu headhunter, and along comes this HOT chick who just died, and you want to make your move on her, and the Zulu's gotta shrink your head, you know? Let me tell ya, the head on your shoulders ain't the only thing that shrinks when they cast that Mojo on ya, and that sure don't help with the ladies, y'know?
I hate when that happens.
So you finally answered the question, albeit in a roundabout way; her grandparents are headed to the Hot Place.
Unrepentant sinners are so transparent. They spend there whole lives trying to evade the realization of their sinful nature.
Well, we have something in common then. You have demonstrated no small skill in the art of evasion yorself.
Now we see that you were just trying to bait us and waste the time of a lot of sincere people here who where trying to help your so called "little Hindu friend".
Just asking for a little truth in packaging in plain English.
Well I guess the game is over now and you have revealed for what you are, an unrepentant liar. That will be your legacy now on FreeRepublic.com
You sure have no problem stating your opinion on THAT issue in plain English! I would call that selective candor.
We have nothing more to discuss.
We'll see if you remain true to those words, or whether your pride gets the best of you.
I believe that God reveals the truth of himself to everyone in some form they can understand. As they accept or reject that truth, he will make his judgement. Does this mean that everyone has the chance to accept Christ?...unfortunately not, but even Paul the Apostle realized that, and stated that the God's law is written on every heart, thus giving the Holy Spirit the ability to reveal God's truths in the proper circumstance. As I stated earlier, then a choice is made to accept or reject.
"Did his experience have an effect on your own faith?"
Great questions churchillbuff;
Thinking back to that time period I'd have to say "yes" his NDE & testimony helped my faith, because I was still a baby Christian, and I hadn't heard that much about NDE's back then.
I suppose folks were fearful that others would think they were crazy, and didn't want to talk about their experience. But I would encourage everyone to share their NDE's as it will help others that's lost to become believers.
And strange as it might seem it was his half sister that had witnessed to me the "good news" about Jesus that started me on my own search to find God & to start reading the Bible. She had given me a Bible a few years before his accident.
So I was able to tell him more of the "good news" about Jesus after his accident...whereas before his accident he wouldn't want to hear anything about God, Jesus, or the Bible. Afterwards he just wanted to make sure that he never returns to the place of horrors that he saw.
"Did he ever put into words what he had witnessed, and what the meaning - as he took it - was?"
His take on his NDE was..."he knew that this life isn't it, that we go somewhere else when this body dies, and we're still able to think...see...remember, & travel. He thought he had some type of body, but couldn't describe what it was like. But most important to him was what did he need to do so he didn't end up in the last place he visited"!
He had found it so strange and weird that he was able to watch the doctors working on his body while he was on the ceiling watching, so he knew he wasn't in his physicial body, and he wasn't in any pain or suffering.
He also talked about floating out of the hospital and then seeing St. Peter & the Pearly Gates (his words)...he said this part was beautiful, but he wasn't allowed to go in... then he left there...this is at the point he grew fearful and didn't want to talk about the rest of his journey.
No matter how many questions I would ask him about what else he saw...he would turn white & start shaking and said he just couldn't talk about the rest of it & what he saw...it was to scarey to him.
I haven't seen him in many years, so I don't know if he's ever gotten the courage to talk about the rest of his trip or not.
You know one when you see one, do you?
They spend there whole lives trying to evade the realization of their sinful nature.
What looks like evasion to you might be a question. Some of us are simply looking for realization.
Why do you accept your real nature is 'sinful' and not divine?
Why are you here?
Interesting...
Never heard of Rampa. I read the BIBLE as those who want to go to heaven do. I am the way, the truth, and the life everlasting saith the LORD. No man cometh to the father but through me. Those who deny me before men, I will deny before my father who sent me. That applies to EVERYONE, including muslims.
Tom Lehrer. A great comedian/singer. He had a lot of great lines such as "It is a sobering thought to consider that when Mozart was my age, he had been dead for two years."
Yes, I know Richard D. Feynman, chapter and verse. He was arguably the best physics TEACHER of the 20th century. His 1960s Lectures on Physics(3 book set)are still relavent and should be required reading in physics classes. He told a funny anecdote : he had just come back from Norway after getting his Nobel Prize, on his way to CERN. Got invited to this big party featuring european royalty. An older ROYAL lady, all covered with jewelry and make up, asks him : and what do you do young man? He launches into physics...on about the third sentence the most amazing thing happened : her whole face just GLAZED OVER, she turned away and started talking to someone else. Tells it like it is, yes? As physics, science, religion all come together, some get it, but most people's face's just GLAZE OVER and they go mumbling off...
I've used that analogy with my kids too.
DING! DING! DING! We have a winna!!!
Close enough anyway, he was quoting Hen3ry, a man who made his living giving advice to people who were happier than he was....
And I believe this is the way it will be when I enter heaven. I will know everyone by name even though I never personally met most of them.
" Reincarnation is not taught in the Bible"
I know the fatuousness of debating with Biblical fundamentalists. It is pointless. No minds are going to be changed nor is that my purpose. I do find it interesting that fundamendalists always interpret the Bible literally until it comes to an uncomfortable literalism that requires an 'explanation.'
Such as: "No man can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again." (John Ch.3) That's pretty literal to me, and I don't need anyone 'explaining' it to me.
Jesus explaining that John the Baptist is the reincarnation of Elijah. "For all the prophets and the law have prophesied until John. And if you are willing to receive it, he is Elijah who was to come." (Matt. 11:13-14)
"Though they dig down to the depths of the grave, from there my hand will take them. Though they climb up to the heavens, from there I will bring them down." (Amos 9:2)
Sounds like God is returning ascended souls to earth to me if I dare to interpret this literally.
In Revelations it is told about Jesus's Second Coming:
"Look he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him." (Rev. 1:7)
How exactly is it that those who pierced Him will be able to see if they have not been reincarnated?
And as for the Biblical quote you stated to me,
"it is appointed unto men once to die."
Unfortunately, lots of people in the Bible died more than once. Lazarus comes to mind. This thread alone has shown how people have died on operating tables only to be 'returned.'
More people in this world believe in reincarnation than not. Early Christians (Origen, the Gnostics) and Jesus taught reincarnation until its teaching was banned in 553AD by the Roman church - an edict by Gregory, the Bishop of Nyssa - because it made the teaching of salvation inconvenient.
When you think about it a belief in reincarnation and karma does not violate Christian teachings any more than evolution denies creation. It fact karmic teachings make God a MORE just God in my mind. I have never understood how a person could live a life of sinfulness, murder, and debauchery (Bill CLinton comes to mind) and in his last breath accept Christ and be saved.
Nor could I understand how God could allow little children to suffer. If you believe in karma/reincarnation you neither have to question or blame God - since our spirits choose our lives and fates.
Read about the humble life of Edgar Cayce and his incredible health and life 'readings' in the book,
"There is a River." It validated what I've always felt inside.
This website also gives a great history of reincarnation in the church: Sorry I don't know how to link it for you.
http://www.near-death.com/experiences/origen03.html
So, in order to give any person future direction for their lives, I must either adjust the scripture so that she is pleased with the status of all dead relatives thereby telling her that she can follow along exactly as her grandparents who never saw the scripture did. Or, I judge the lives of all dead people as if I am God and know all their circumstances. Or, a third option, I tell her that the Bible she is now reading only went into effect this day and all prior people were under a different set of rules. So, in effect, I have to lie to her or play God.
No thanks.
Just what is the purpose of getting into those judgements? To give her a pompous, protective reason to reject any different teaching from God? To make her choose between the religion of her grandparents and her religion? To make it harder for her to grow to know the Lord and His direction?
Do we require that science conform to all prior beliefs before we can understand a different direction? Does she only want salvation if she can bring along all prior generations with her? None of us get to create a religion that conforms to what we want to hear. If we do, we are just creating a religion and exactly what is that going to get us? A false, created religion that does nothing.
Keep it simple. Leave the past to those that have gone before and let God handle it as God chooses. Which is what is going to happen anyway.
We just get the option to teach the living the truth. Why mislead them by tampering with what you or I think God wants or will do?
1. One day, it will happen to you.
2. There's nothing you can do about it.
3. You may as well be a good person, just in case you do have to face St. Peter after you die.
4. Beyond that, it's pointless to worry about it.
Regards, Ivan
Some of you might have noticed something I notice on these religion threads.
Man will accept any hearsay story as the absolute truth with absolutely no proof required. Man will believe any claim of lost scripture suddenly found that says ..........., man will believe every one of the NDE stories on an internet website with no proof or not provable.
But,,,,,, if it is the Bible, Jesus telling us what to do for salvation, if it means we have to do something to get eternal life, man will not accept it unless......
----we can provide documented proof of all creation and all questions on creation
----we can provide actual documented witnesses to each and every incidence of teaching or belief in the Bible
----we can give them the religion they have dreamed of all their lives requiring nothing from them, which is all inclusive of any sin.
And, the weird thing. We do that with Jesus paying the price for their sins if they just believe, repent of past sins, are baptised for the remission of those sins and follow Jesus as their savior. But, lo, that is just not enough for these sinners (which we all are), they want to be God themselves and create their personal creation plan.
Should be personal salvation plan for the hereafter.
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