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To: Shalom Israel
“You persistently fail to recognize the existence of private property. “

You wrote that not me. I write that I fail to recognize the validity of you making all the rules, setting terms and conditions, then declaring that I have agreed to an implicit contract you contrived for your own convenience when I deny signing by any means any kind of contract or agreement with the blanket terms you are trying to force on me, and you threaten me with violence for not meeting an obligation to which I did not commit to when all the while you refuse to acknowledge you have any obligation under the social contract because you did not agree to it in the same way that I did not agree to your unilateral ravings. You can’t have it both ways. That makes any sort of discussion rather pointless.

“Among other things, it means that when you find yourself on someone else's land, and he does something about it, you're confused enough to claim the right to defend yourself against the property owner. “

If I find myself on someone else’s land, the implication being that I did not intend to be there, and the something he does about it involves major bodily harm or lose of life to me, I do claim the right to defend myself against his acting on his delusions and I claim the right as a member of our society to explain myself to judge and jury.

498 posted on 02/28/2006 6:55:41 PM PST by KrisKrinkle
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To: KrisKrinkle
I deny signing by any means any kind of contract or agreement with the blanket terms you are trying to force on me

Force is not involved. My property is my own. If you don't want any sort of contractual relationship with me, then stay off my property. Once you enter my property, you have entered some sort of relationship with me: if you entered illicitly, then you've entered a predator-prey relationship; if you entered licitly, then you entered a contractual one.

Nobody forced you into anything, because nobody forced you onto my property.

when all the while you refuse to acknowledge you have any obligation under the social contract because you did not agree to it

I refuse to acknowledge any positive obligations whatsoever. The only obligation that exists a priori is the negative obligation not to aggress against another's person or property.

If I find myself on someone else’s land, the implication being that I did not intend to be there...

The classic example is "falling there from an airplane." The answer is that there are various reasons I would grant you a limited waiver--i.e., permission to get off my land--but I am not obligated to do so. Observe that if you fell onto a military base from an airplane, you would be either arrested or shot, and yet you'd somehow find that understandable. Likewise, my home is my military base. I may feel bad for you, landing there by accident and all, but that doesn't enforceable positive obligations.

I do claim the right to defend myself against his acting on his delusions and I claim the right as a member of our society to explain myself to judge and jury.

Those "rights" are not legitimate, unless you and I are already bound by prior agreement.

503 posted on 03/01/2006 3:58:11 AM PST by Shalom Israel (Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.)
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