The Hagia Sophia, formerly a church, now a mosque.
Considering that they destroyed every Church to buil their mosques or converted them into mosques, a good gesture would be if they gave back them to their original use which was christian. Then we could start speaking about sharing them
"Its construction was begun by Abd al-Rahman I in 785 after pulling down the Visigothic Church of San Vicente. "
Yeah, right! One more effort to convert the community to islam...by spoonfeeding mushy diet of tolerance.
This is positive.
Zapatero will probably be there tomorrow to hand over the keys.
The Hagia Sophia, formerly a church, now a mosque.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/001637.php
Cordoba Cathedral may see return of Muslims
An interesting contrast to the desecration of the cathedral in Kosovo comes from the Guardian, with thanks to Elisot, who points out what this article doesn't mention: that the Cordoba mosque was built on top of a destroyed Christian church. What is also noteworthy about this initiative is the absolute lack of reciprocity from the Islamic world, where numerous churches have been converted to mosques — or even of any apparent sense that any reciprocity is even called for.
Muslims across Spain are lobbying the Roman Catholic church in the southern city of Córdoba to make a symbolic gesture of reconciliation between faiths by allowing them to pray in the city's cathedral.
Córdoba's renaissance cathedral sits in the centre of an ancient mosque complex, and local Muslims want to be allowed to pray there again. They have appealed to the Vatican to intercede on their behalf.
Zakarias Maza, the director of the Taqwa mosque in neighbouring Granada, said yesterday: "We hope the Vatican will give a signal that it has a vision of openness and dialogue.
"It would be good if there were a gesture of tolerance on their part.
"Córdoba has been a symbol of the union of three cultures for centuries. Even now, Jews and Muslims live together with Christians in the neighbourhood around the mosque."
But he added: "The church council doesn't seem to be open to dialogue."
The Muslim community in the south of Spain is growing as a result of immigration from north Africa, and due to Spaniards converting. Córdoba now has some 500 Muslims, too manyfor the city's existing mosque.
There was widespread rejoicing among Muslims last year when a new and prominent mosque was opened in Granada after many years of negotiations, but church leaders in Córdoba appear reluctant to acknowledge the way Spanish society is evolving.
A spokesman for the local bishop told El Mundo that the proposal faced a lot of obstacles and it would be many years before it came to anything.
The proposals have also provoked anger in some parts of Spain's Catholic community.
"Will Christians be able to pray in the mosques of Morocco, Saudi Arabia, Iran or Kuwait?" demanded one contributor to a Catholic website. "Muslims should practise what they preach!"
The Muslim community is going out of its way to portray the proposals as a union, and not a clash of faiths. "In no way is this request about reclaiming our rights - far less any kind of reconquest," Isabel Romero, a member of the Islamic Council of Spain, told a local newspaper.
"Instead, we want to give our support to the universal character of this building."
Nowadays, Córdoba is a small provincial capital in one of the poorer regions in the Spanish interior, but 1,000 years ago it was one of the great cities of the world.
As the capital of Moorish Spain, Córdoba became one of Islam's holiest places, and a centre of Islamic art and scholarship to rival Baghdad.
The original mosque was built in the eighth century, following the conquest.
It was expanded by successive generations of rulers until the city was taken by the Christians again in the 13th century.
With its hundreds of marble columns and distinctive red-and-white brickwork, the mosque is considered one of Moorish Spain's greatest legacies, despite the 16th-century addition of the cathedral in its centre.
It stands at the heart of a Unesco world heritage site.
The addition of the cathedral was only the most recent change of use for a site that has seen the ebb and flow of the world's great religions.
The Visigoths had their own cathedral on the site before they were defeated by the Moors. Before that, a temple to the Roman god Janus had stood there.
For Muslims, the most important part of the mosque is the mihrab, the recess in the south-eastern wall which indicates the direction of Mecca for prayer.
In the Córdoba mosque, the mihrab is outside the cathedral itself, so in theory it would be possible for Muslims to pray without affecting ceremonies in the cathedral.
The Islamic Council has lodged a formal request with the Vatican for Muslims to be allowed to pray in the mosque. "The request was very well received," Mansur Escudero, secretary of the Islamic council, told El Mundo.
The plan also has support from local politicians. Antonio Hurtado, a spokesman for the local Socialists, told El Mundo: "We hope to see Córdoba become a place for the meeting of faiths."
The city's United Left (IU) mayor, Rosa Aguilar, is also believed to be in favour of the move, although she has said that now is not the time for the council to debate the issue.
"There has been a series of meetings between the IU and the Islamic Council to open up a dialogue between religions," her deputy, Andrès Ocaòa, told Europa Press. "In today's world, we have to make every effort to maximise our knowledge of different cultures to help us live together better."
Posted by Robert at April 19, 2004 02:05 PM | Print this entry
Comments
(Note: Comments on articles are unmoderated, and do not necessarily reflect the views of Dhimmi Watch or Robert Spencer. Comments that are off-topic, offensive, slanderous, or otherwise annoying may be summarily deleted. However, the fact that particular comments remain on the site IN NO WAY constitutes an endorsement by Robert Spencer of the views expressed therein.)
Oriana Fallaci's La Forza della Ragione details just how fully many in the Vatican, and individual bishops and priests, have collaborated in making Italy, and other parts of Europe, welcoming for Muslims, even handing over churches for use by Muslims as living quarters. Her long indictment is overwhelming. It goes far beyond the desire to placate Muslims because otherwise they may harm Christians in the Middle East, and has become a vehicle for those priests who detest their own civilization, and exhibit a diseased sympathy for those who would not, for one minute, were Muslims to rule, to tolerate them or their own believers. Surely at Cordoba, with the bluish whitewash of the walls, and narrow streets, and the reddish gitanillas hanging over the balconies in the Juderia, a stand must be taken, and this request, with its sinister cheek, be rejected. Somewhere there has to be a Charles Martel moment -- if not in Cordoba, then by closing the mosques in Rome and Paris and Brussels and London and...Europe must be made not friendly, but hostile, to demographic conquest, and removing the mosques will be indispensable.
The idea that the Christians are being asked for a gesture of reconciliation, just after the Madrid bombing, and then the desecration of the corpse -- taken out of the grave -- of the Spanish anti-terrorist policeman, fills one with fury.
Posted by: Hugh at April 19, 2004 03:10 PM
What reconciliation are muslims expecting? It was they who invaded. Where is their apology for this? When will they be asked to renounce their "Colonialism?"
They bemoan the Crusades like a broken record but ignore their own transgressions.
I believe the secular aspects of the government and city council will pressure the Catholic Church in the area to placate the muslims. I hope that the Church of Rome will deny the request and sled light on the one-sidedness of muslim's requests.
Here is an interesting fact, the spokeswoman for the Islamic Council is a convert. Because Spain is mainly Roman Catholic, she most likely was Christian. Because she has left the True Faith, she is an apostate. She is still alive and well. She would not be afforded the same if she decided to leave Islam.
Which is the more compassionate and tolerant Faith?
John
Posted by: John at April 19, 2004 05:22 PM
Reading articles like this makes so angry I can't even put into words! The unmitigated gall of these people!
A little help please...
Can someone tell me the correct pronunciation of dhimmi?
Posted by: Skeptic at April 19, 2004 07:35 PM
Islam is saying "Welcome back, we missed you, you had to know you were ours all along." Of course the Spanish will give in because they have accepted their dhimmitude.
As for any expectation of reciprocity, the return of churches from the clutches of Islam, don't hold your breath. For Islam, Muslims are people, and non-Muslims are not. They are Infidels, beings fit only for hell, lower than dogs. (Which to Muslims are pretty darn low as it is.)
They will not be satisfied until all the non-Muslim holy places have been destroyed, converted to mosques, museums, or placed under "Muslim protection," and all living creatures are subjected to their will.
Posted by: epg at April 19, 2004 09:03 PM
The honey venom slides from the muslim mouth that it would be a good jester for the vatican. The truth is thay will make a mockery of this jester as thay have done before. The pope will grant their wishes, falling to the venom of satans children and their friendship. Christianity will not survive with weak links to defend it; if the vatican should complie let us christians and jews worship in a mosque as a sign of our undying friendship with the muslim.
Posted by: christian at April 19, 2004 09:11 PM
The grand myth of the "creative, tolerant Andalus" should be exposed.
Granted, at rare times, temporarily, it manifested some positive qualities - in comparison to the Europe of the Dark Ages and to other parts of the Dar el-Islam then - but, objectively, it was never the paradise which it's often nowadays painted by the apologists for Jihad.
Normally, it was a society where dhimmitude was rigidly enforced: the fact that a tiny handful of Jews and Christians could occasionally, exceptionally, aberrantly, rise out of their endemic wretchedness (shared with the bulk of the Moslems living there) made it slightly better than anything else around at that period, but it was hardly the good and just place that it's idolized as today.
Great care ought to be applied in heaping praise on el-Andalus; no effort at all should be expended to return to its spurious "glory-days".
Posted by: HG at April 20, 2004 02:57 AM
There is NO way that ANY Christian church should allow Muslim services - would a mosque in Egypt, etc allow for Christian services in it?
The old glory days of Andalucia are soon to become the "gory days" for the dhimmis in Spain.
jihan
Posted by: jihan at April 20, 2004 07:01 AM
They bemoan the Crusades because they [the Muslims] started the crusades and then lost much of what they conquered.
Posted by: Malcolm at April 20, 2004 11:49 AM
White muslim converts, like reformed smokers, are the most zealous is pushing muslim demands, cf. Adel Smith in Italy with crucifixes in the classroom. Also, isn't Ibrahim Cooper of Cair one?
Posted by: Silvester at April 20, 2004 02:13 PM
This is great news! Calling for Muslims to renounce their false religion, and begin praying to God, instead of the false god allah. We Christians should welcome this opportunity for the conversion of the Muslim community.
Over my dead body. Deus Volt.