Pissin' and moanin' since 1492
This and Indian Power are the most abundant bumper stickers on the Rez where I work.
Posted on 11/24/2005 5:13:54 PM PST by lainie
ALCATRAZ ISLAND, United States (AFP) - A tribal chant rose from a thousands-strong prayer circle on Alcatraz Island in San Francisco Bay as Native Americans held a sunrise "Unthanksgiving Day" ceremony.
"What we call it is Unthanksgiving," Bear Lincoln of the Wailikie Tribe told AFP as he waved burning sage to purify the area and ward off evil spirits.
"It was the saddest day for us. It was a big mistake for us to help the Pilgrims survive that first winter. They betrayed us once they got their strength."
Traditional Thanksgiving feasting in the United States is a tribute to the meal the original European Pilgrims shared with the Native Americans who helped them survive in the new land.
An estimated 3,000 people packed onto ferries that set out from Fisherman's Wharf for Alcatraz in the pre-dawn darkness Thursday, according to organizers.
A bonfire blazed at the center of a prayer circle set up on a bluff beneath the Alcatraz lighthouse. And at the base of the rock wall leading up to the ruins of the former federal prison were a pair of Indian teepees.
"Ultimately, this is their land," said Irma Pinedo, a Mexico City native who was among the Aztec dancers taking part in the ceremony. "For us, no turkey today."
Turkey, which nearly became the national bird in the United States instead of the eagle, is the main course at traditional Thanksgiving dinners.
"I take my children to this every year because I want them to understand there is another side to the story," said 41-year-old Erin Alexander, who added that the event has grown significantly since she began attending 12 years ago.
(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.netscape.cnn.com ...
I think God sent the Puritans, and other Christan groups to occupy this land, just like He sent Moses to occupy Israel. I believe He even told Moses to have his soldiers to thoroughly clean out the people living in the "promised land".
America is kind of the second "promised land" established by God if you will. If America were suddenly to disappear from the earth, all the countries here would revert back into feudel, warlord societies, scientific advances would grind to a halt, and freedom everywhere would die.
What kind of land do you think America would be now if the indians had won?
Sorry, I accept your appology and offer my own:)
No doubt the fellows out in the deserts didn't build them ~ really can't figure out why you'd need one at Ayers Rock for example ~ but they also got down to Tasmania, and that was before they'd invented much technology related to making clothing.
Martin's Hundred is another one of those places the English stole from French Huguenots who'd been in the area since the late 1500s.
Superior in what way? Just by looking at this thread, you can see the ignorance inherent in a good percentage of the population as to the individuality of Indians. A lot here on this thread, instead of seeing us as individuals, group us into the same old tired leftist stereotypes, all because of some numbskulls out in California.
Socialism is nothing more than slavery. As for the government programs, whether it be to Indians or any other person, it does not equate to superior treatment. The best treatment that could be given would be to see them as individuals and gauge them on that basis. You can see by this thread that not everyone is willing to do that. It's also something that cannot be legislated.
Ignorance abounds and the idiots in SF bay aren't the only ones partaking.
That also dates the arrival of the various plagues that wiped out so many millions of Indians.
The Choctaw, related to the Cherokee, who were settled in Oklahoma (in about the largest reservation ever laid out) came from further West. One band of Choctaw has a tradition that a spirit told them to cut a horse loose and follow it East until it stopped to graze. So they did, and arrived somewhere North of Wichita, Kansas. Similarly, a Church of the First Born congregation said an angel came to them and told them to cut a horse loose and follow it West (from Indiana) until it stopped to graze. So they did, and arrived at Zenda, Kansas.
After much thinking I've come to the conclusion that these are different stories, and not simply the same story retold by two groups.
A whole bunch of people from both groups live in and near Altus, OK.
Last evening I couldn't recall their name, but they are called the Brotherton Indians ~ this group became Christian almost as soon as the Dutch got off their boats. They have also adhered to the Oneida and the mother of a whole bunch of the Jordan guys (all certified Oneida tribal members) was an adopted Oneida. Their poppa was a French Huguenot fur trader.
She was also the junior wife of a French fur trader who'd adopted many "native" customs.
As an anthro student in the late 80s, I would have given Thor Hyerdahl's theory of Mediterranean cultures influencing South and Meso-American cultures more credence if he had not also come out and said that the reason why Neanderthalensis had thick, heavy brow ridges was to keep rain out of the eyes.
"And before that, the Indians were doing the same thing to each other."
I was looking for someone to point this out.
Indians fighting Indians (Aztecs vs. Mayans)..okay.
Europeans fighting Indians (Spanish vs Aztecs)..not okay.
And many other examples. What am I missing here?
Their adaptation to the Ice Age is simply different than our own eh.
More recently (just before he died) Thor came up with the idea that the Aesir were actual people who'd come from what is now Azerbaijan in Roman times. He ended up finding caves in Azerbaijan with what most believe to be Scandinavian symbology.
Whether he was right or wrong on that, a linguist at Indiana University made a truly major discovery ~ he found that the 9 existing Sa'ami languages (spoken mostly in far Northern Norway) have a well known cognate called Sumerian, and really aren't part of the Finno-Ughric subgroup of the Altaic-Uralic group of languages spoken throughout central Asia (although Sa'ami does share much of its vocabulary with those languages).
He also found a cognate American Indian language which is apparantly still spoken by some people in a tribe currently located in California.
However, that wasn't his biggest find ~ he determined that the Sumerians also designed the first character set used for a written language in China, and did the same job for the Egyptians.
The Sa'ami didn't invent writing, but they did produce pictographs/ideographs on the undersides of cliff faces and other places in Finland thousands of years ago. One of them portrays a classical Polar story about the woman who failed to find suitible husbands for her daughters. The result was she was turned into stone and the girls slept with ol'dad.
Where have we heard that story before?
This continues to be a hot story among the natives in Siberia.
I don't think Hyerdahl had any Sa'ami ancestry or he'd latched onto that stuff first. Still, there seems to be some sort of zone for animal herds that extends from the Arctic to the Caspian.
If you ever get the chance check out the Art Museum at Indiana University. They have a large plexiglas board up with imbedded artifacts from the Fertile Crescent. One of them is a little statue of a reindeer!
If neolithic people in Eur-Asia could get around like that, certainly the American Indians could go pretty much where they pleased.
Why would anyone not want to free tax slaves?
Thanks for the information! If you have an archaeology ping list, please include me. I am on blam's and SunkenCiv's as well.
You can't loose what you don't own.
The indians did not have "land ownership". Claiming to own land is only something that started AFTER the settlers came.
(people forget, that the indians thought THEY were cheating the dutch by selling manhattan. In their mindset NO land can be owned.)
This is just more "pro-communist"/collective ownership disguised as something else bs.
You are SO correct, and it has ultimately become my way of thinking as well. Of all the horrible things that europeans have foisted on the indians, the insidiousness of socialism has to be the worst, and I would love to see indians break away from that slavery. Seems like those of more leftist persuasion only wish to perpetuate the victimhood in another form of slavery.
I wonder if anyone on this board has heard of David Yeagley? (www.badeagle.com)
They knew what territories were theres, and which were not, and who had hunting rights, or fishing rights, and who didn't.
I think folks are confusing precision land surveys with "ownership".
"Had some native genius invented the wheel in North America, the Euros would have found the conquest far more difficult to accomplish."
American Indians did not develop urban centers which require overland roads, infra structures and city streets. There was no need for Indians to "invent the wheel" when the Travois suited their austere lifestyle. Indians developed foot paths to seasonal quarters and to hunting regions. It is interesting to compare Aztec and Mayan highly centralized, sophisticated city-societies and ruling structures with the Egyptian Dynastic society. North American Indians for the most part evolved into small, self-subsisting communal, independent tribal and clan societies each governed by a council of wise elders. This structure contrasts with the inherited order of mythic-god rulers and ruling elites of the highly centralized So. & Cent. Americas' Indian societies which imposed tribute and taxes to support elite governance.
One could say that tribal and clan structures emulated little free republics.
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