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To: CWW; jb6; TexasGreg
I have met many, many priests in my 43 years, and have only met one who was a homosexual and who was removed for molestation of a minor.

Here is an editorial, which appeared in The Kansas City Star just a couple of days ago defending a homosexual Jesuit. http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/news/columnists/mary_sanchez/12748519.htm

Homosexuality and the Roman Catholic Church
Sad, risky policy of exclusion
MARY SANCHEZ

My favorite priest was gay.

I never knew that when he was alive.

Few did.

Father Thom Savage died of AIDS in 1999. (Hmmmmm, that leaves little doubt as to Fr. Savage keeping his vows of celebacy.)

So this can be said about him now, without fear that new decrees from the Vatican will out him, somehow canceling his work for God.

Father Savage was the enigmatic Jesuit priest who became president of Rockhurst University in 1988, when it still was Rockhurst College.

To say Father Savage was brilliant is an understatement of massive proportions. He graduated summa cum laude, made Phi Beta Kappa and held two master’s degrees and a doctorate.

While some newcomers take years to build the social connections and clout to make an impact, Father Savage seemed to have carried the ability with his luggage from the East Coast. He simply had it. No need for cultivation.

During his eight years in Kansas City, Father Savage served on many prestigious boards and co-chaired the city’s master plan.

I met him during his first days in Kansas City. As a young reporter, writing about higher education was among my duties. At 41, Father Savage was the youngest president of any Jesuit college in the nation.

Savage’s impressive resume had been well-documented. A short feature story to add a few details was all editors wanted. I requested half an hour, 45 minutes tops, of his time. I stayed in his office for three hours.

The afternoon was the best type of interview — more a conversation than a question-and-answer session. Father Savage was gregarious, savvy and clear about his vision for Rockhurst.

Later, the topics were less about social planning and more about faith. He became less the college president, more the Jesuit priest. I was less the reporter and more the young woman still wrestling with qualms spawned in parochial grade school.

We laughed at my memories of strict nuns and playgrounds where boys were separated from girls by a yellow painted line. We talked about how as a youngster my questions about doctrine were dismissed as being too questioning.

We discussed the church’s teachings at levels I’d never heard before.

He thought my problem was not a lack of faith but more an analytical mindset that had clashed with the way I had been first instructed.

I always say that had I known Jesuits earlier in life, many of my frustrations with Catholicism would have been lessened, if not eliminated.

That is a generalization. The truth is that the Jesuit who made the difference was Father Savage.

I suspect many people have stories of how this man affected their lives, as Catholics, as city planners, as elected officials, as professors and as students.

I applaud the church for attempting to further address the horror of priests who have abused young children. But homosexuality is not the same as pedophilia.

In fact, some priests and scholars who study the church have already suggested this move may aggravate, not solve, the problem of child abuse. Their reasoning is sound.

The priests who were convicted of sexual assaults did not go though seminary in more recent years, when the church began to be more pro-active and open about dealing with the difficulties of celibacy. The priests who caused the harm were more a function of the years when the church didn’t discuss such things. The approach inadvertently formed a haven for pedophiles.

And as a Catholic, the latest news from the Vatican saddens me.

The God I pray to created all human beings. I believe he made some of them gay.

I thank him for the Rev. Thom Savage.
28 posted on 09/30/2005 11:45:52 AM PDT by GarySpFc (Sneakypete, De Oppresso Liber)
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To: GarySpFc

Note this author's obsession with prestigious degrees and titles, and with fancy social connections. What the devil does any of that have to do with being a good priest or a good Catholic? Jesus was a carpenter. This woman's shallow values make her the condign person to praise a priest who obviously wasn't true to his vows.


104 posted on 09/30/2005 1:20:55 PM PDT by utahagen
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To: GarySpFc

The letter your post made several assertions which do not reflect objective truth. Here are just a couple:

"The God I pray to created all human beings. I believe he made some of them gay."

There is zero evidence that anyone is born "gay". Even homosexual activist researchers who have tried for years to prove that there is a "gay" gene, that people are born "gay", have had to admit they haven't found the evidence they're looking for. Here's a link that give a lot of information about the actual causes of homosexuality. I suggest you give it a read:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1420619/posts
Root Causes, Homosexual Consequences

"But homosexuality is not the same as pedophilia."

Consider this: roughly one third of all child molestation is same sex. Homosexuals are about 2% of the population, yet one third of child molestation is same sex. That should tell you something. If you read the article and info on the thread linked above, you'll find more information about homosexuality and child and adolescent molestation. A much higher percentage of homosexuals were sexually molested when young, and continue the practice as adults. Not all, not most - but a MUCH higher percentage than the general population. (Actually, a huge percentage of homosexuals were molested when young. It is definitely one of the most pervasive factors contributing to homosexuality.)

Before supporting homosexuality in the priesthood any more, you owe it to yourself and those reading this forum to educate yourself.


113 posted on 09/30/2005 1:34:56 PM PDT by little jeremiah (A vitiated state of morals, a corrupted public conscience, are incompatible with freedom. P. Henry)
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To: GarySpFc
The priests who were convicted of sexual assaults did not go though seminary in more recent years, when the church began to be more pro-active and open about dealing with the difficulties of celibacy.

My brother-in-law went through the Seminary in the mid to late 60's and was ordained in 1970. This would have been about the same time as many of the priests who have been accused or convicted of abuse. While he was still in the Seminary, the whole idea of celibacy began to be discarded among the liberals and feminists who were beginning to be appointed to the Vocations Boards and Seminary administrations.

Prior to that time, celibacy WAS discussed and the young men had the chance to talk about the difficulties of their choice, and they all knew what they were choosing. In the very late 60's the attitudes began to change, and the young men were no longer taught how to live the celibate life. The idea began to be floated that the Church was going to change the rules so they wouldn't have to deal with that 'outdated notion' anymore. My b-i-l and the men in his class tried to tell the younger men that those new notions were a load of frap, but the young men didn't want to listen. As a result, there were too many men in the 70's who were ordained under false pretenses. They believed, because they were told by the teachers and leaders in the Seminaries, that they would not have to abide by that vow of celibacy that they would be taking; that things would be changing.

How many of those priests who had sex with young men did so because of that notion that they were free to do what they wanted? There were some men who DID leave the Seminaries, and even the Priesthood when it became clear that they had believed a lie perpetrated by the liberals in the Seminaries. I wish the others who had no intention of ever remaining celibate had done the same.

147 posted on 09/30/2005 5:33:49 PM PDT by SuziQ
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To: GarySpFc
And as a Catholic, the latest news from the Vatican saddens me.

The God I pray to created all human beings. I believe he made some of them gay.

Stop thinking, and read your Bible... Your belief is not based on Scripture, but your own desire. You may have known a good man, but if he was a practicing homosexual, he was perverting his own existence, by pretending to be a man of God.

God gave us the ability to make our own decisions. He set Adam and Eve into the garden, and told them they could have anything, but not to eat from the TREE of KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL. They did. We know the rest of the story. WE KNOW right from wrong.

If you around a child, watch carefully. He/she will give you a furtive glance, when he knows he getting ready to test your will... and does something just to spite you, or provoke a response.

God told man to lie with woman. He wasn't talking about two mommies or two daddies...

The RC church's stance on priestly celibacy is also not scripturally based. It is based on their decision to make it part of their requirements for the priesthood. Jesus was a little more inclusive, and Paul directly told us that church leaders must be tested, and must be married to ONE WIFE.

213 posted on 10/01/2005 6:50:50 AM PDT by pageonetoo (You'll spot their posts soon enough!)
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To: GarySpFc
Why does this guy think we are supposed to admire a priest who obviously did not follow church teachings?

This priest was an example of why homosexual men should not be priests.

249 posted on 10/02/2005 4:45:25 PM PDT by tuesday afternoon (Everything happens for a reason. - 40 and 43)
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