Victims may have died before crash( Passengers frozen solid! )

CNN ^ | 08/15/2005 | CNN

[devane617]

ATHENS, Greece (CNN) -- Investigators were working to determine why a Cypriot plane apparently suffered a catastrophic loss of cabin pressure and slammed into a Greek mountain -- possibly with all 121 people on board already dead. All but two of the bodies have been recovered, a Greek government spokesman said Monday, and officials hope autopsies and cockpit recorders will hold clues to Sunday's crash of Helios Airways Flight 522. The autopsies were ordered to determine if the 115 passengers and six crew were already dead or oxygen-starved before the crash, the spokesman said. A Greek Defense Ministry source with access to the investigation told Reuters that most of the bodies recovered were "frozen solid."

[maestro]

...thanks for 'timeline'....

...one would think if radio contact broken.....many, many, cell phones would have let everybody know about 'the problem'...

?The whole crew didn't have 'access' to a dozen cell phones?

/wireless?

[brazzaville]

Good morning.
"s/he wouldn't wait to pass out and freeze solid before trying to take corrective action."

I believe the F-16s reported that the copilot was slumped over the controls but the pilot was not visible in the cockpit. Maybe he/she was trying to fix the problem and failed or maybe he/she caused the problem.

Any Freepers know what 300 to 400 mph of freezing air blowing over people dressed for summer would do? I've been in -50 degrees with 20 knots of wind and I know that exposed skin freezes in seconds in those conditions.

I'm also curious as to whether or not the Greek fighters saw any identifiable damage and whether or not they watched the crash.

Michael Frazier

[GovernmentShrinker]

If they saw any damage to the exterior, it would probably have been reported, unless there's a deliberate attempt to dover up evidence of a terrorist action. But an explosion that didn't put a visible hole in the plane's exterior could still do the job depending on what parts it damaged/destroyed.

[Boundless]

> ... one would think if radio contact broken.....many,
> many, cell phones would have let everybody know about
> 'the problem'...

1. not if the passengers were unconscious, and they'd
likely precede the crew in that

2. not over open water where there are no cells

But it sounds like at least one message got out.

[July 4th]

You can breathe well above 11,000 feet; I don't think breathing is dangerously impaired until 18-20,000 feet. People around here climb Mt. Rainier without oxygen, and it's 14,000 feet.

True that you can breathe at 18,000, but only with acclimatization. Hikers are fine, because their increase in altitude is gradual, but for someone on a plane, rapid decompression means the altitude change is almost instantaneous.

[GovernmentShrinker]

I also wonder why there weren't dozens of cell phone and text messages. If I'd been on a flight that was obviously in serious trouble, and it appeared the pilot and co-pilot were out of commission, I'd be dialing anyone I could find, asking them to connect to 911 (I assume there's a European equivalent), and then have 911 patch through to a control tower.

[Lazamataz]

I saw it in "The X-Men" and in "The Day After Tomorrow" (the "science" in the latter was labeled "solid" by "President" Al Gore, so you know it's the schizzle.)

When I become Emperor, it will be a felony for white men in their thirties to say "schizzle".

[KarlInOhio]

2. not over open water where there are no cells

I wonder how the text message one passenger sent got out. Maybe he typed it into his phone and it queued up there until the plane got in range of land after all the passengers were incapacitated or dead. It would be interesting to check the timestamp for when it was typed and when it was actually sent.

[Spiff]

Being an Environmental System Specialis/technician in Air Force. The Temperatures at 30,000 feet are below zero. If cabin pressure is lost in flight, oxygen loss (hypoxia) will cause the passengers to pass out. loss of the AC/heating will cause them to ..well... freeze at altitude. The AC System actually pressurizes the aircraft.

So, a terrorist need only disable the pilots and the AC System at high altitude and subsequent events take care of the rest.

[OneTime]

I just heard on a newsbreak on WABC radio the the person who claimed to receive the text message has been arrested and the message was a hoax.

I have not see anything on the web yet.

[Zavien Doombringer]

that is possible...

[OneTime]

oops. "not seen"

[pa mom]

It was a charter flight, it seems. Those always scare me.

[Zavien Doombringer]

take out the pilots and you all ready have a series of catastrophic events going to take place. Why stop at the AC, why not just shut off the fuel supply at least they will go down in a bit of comfort....why not the electrical, the pnuematic/hydraulic system...

Anything that doesn't work in the orchestrated events of an aircraft could or will cause a problem in the safety of the crew and or passengers...

[KarlInOhio]

So much for my theory about the phone saving the message until it got in tower range.

What type of sick SOB would make this type of hoax. And what type of idiot would make it and not expect to be quickly caught since every text message is tracked for billing purposes. No message coming into his phone, or it comes from someone not on the plane, and he is nailed.

[dfwgator]

Isn't that basically what happened to Payne Stewart's plane?

[Hank Rearden]

I have been in -30...but wearing a huge parka and not out in it that long. Everything in your nose freezes when you breethe.

I've been out in -60F in Greenland; one of the strangest experiences of my life. Even well-protected, my throat and nose froze just from the water vapor of breathing. Survival times at those temps are measured in minutes if shelter isn't found.

[GovernmentShrinker]

That individual should be locked in a freezer and left there. What a sicko!

[Old Professer]

The report was that the plane was at 34,000 feet when contact was lost; at that altitude it was -50 degrees fahrenheit or so.

[Caesar Soze]

Why stop at the AC, why not just shut off the fuel supply at least they will go down in a bit of comfort.

You must have a different definition of "comfort" than I do. Reminds me of a joke.

I hope to die comfortably, in my sleep, like my grandfather. Not screaming in terror like the passengers in his car.