Posted on 08/01/2005 7:21:44 PM PDT by satchmodog9
Hiroshima and Nagasaki
While most may not remember the details, they do know about that famous B-29 bomber which dropped two atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki Japan, for all practical purposes ending World War Two. The Smithsonian has completed a cosmetic restoration of the Enola Gay, the plane that dropped the bombs, and is now on display. As expected, a large sized hullabaloo has arisen over the way Harry Truman decided to end the war. Various old saws are paraded about, such as the hackneyed and untrue one that, "The Japanese had already sued for peace," "Atomic weapons shouldn't have been used," and "Unnecessary lives were lost." After 60 years, a lot of facts have been lost, buried, or conveniently forgotten. Allow me to refresh your memory.
The Japanese hadn't sued for peace at all, but were continuing the war, as if nothing had happened, vowing to kill all the POW's if they lost. As each island was captured, it was discovered that Allied prisoners had been shot, beheaded, drowned, burned, or in some other way killed in the most unmentionable atrocities. The professional hand wringers remember two dates: August 6th, 1945, when the first atomic bomb was dropped on Hiroshima, and August 9th, when a larger one was dropped on Nagasaki. Here are a few more pertinent dates, which will explain August 6th and 9th, 1945.
Even though the Jap navy had been largely sunk, air force decimated, and factories destroyed, they fought on, as if all was going well. They considered themselves to be a superior race, which could not be beaten by inferior 'white devils.' Then came the B-29 "Super Fortress." On the nights of March 9 and 10, the largest air raid in history took place over Tokyo, with 279 B-29's unloading fire bombs, totally destroying 16 square miles of that city with five million inhabitants. 63% of the commercial district, and 18% of the remaining industrial capacity was destroyed in these raids. 250,000 buildings were destroyed, and possibly as many as 100,000 killed. The flames could be seen a hundred miles at sea by the crews, as they returned to their home bases or carriers. Next month, the B-29's came back again, further destroying Tokyo. Still, the Japanese acted as if nothing had happened, continued to kill POW's, and believing Tojo's words, that all was going well. The 'white devils' were being smashed.
On May 24th and 25th, the Super Fortresses came back again, this time another record being set, with 558 planes over Tokyo, this time destroying half the city, with 56.3 miles being reduced to ashes. Still no surrender. By the end of June, 13 million Japanese were homeless, and 58 smaller cities were being hit. On July 10th, 2,000 planes were in the air over Japan. B-29's, as well as fighters were bombing everything in sight, and even dropping leaflets, giving the schedules as to what cities were next in line.
Surrender was not in the Jap lexicon. Rather than being taken prisoner or surrendering, hundreds of thousands of them committed hari-kari. On Iwo Jima, 21,000 Jap soldiers died, and on Okinawa, 70,000. The Emperor expected them to resist to the death, and they followed instructions. On July 26th, Japan was told to give up or face prompt and utter destruction. On August 1st, 836 B-29's again broke records for the largest bomb drop, and number of planes in air raid history. No reply.
Truman had enough. He knew the Japs had promised no POW would be spared, and an invasion of the mainland would cost a million lives of both the Japs and Allies. There was absolutely no reasoning with them. On August 6th, the Enola Gay (maiden name of the pilot's mother) came over Hiroshima at 31,600 feet, and dropped "Little Boy," killing perhaps 100,000. After the drop, Truman said that Japan must give up or, "Face a rain of ruin from the air, the like of which had never been seen on this earth." No reply. Three days later, on August 9th, "Fat Man" was dropped over Nagasaki, killing perhaps another 50,000. Still no surrender. Finally, on August 15th, almost a week after Nagasaki had been destroyed, and over a week after Hiroshima, the Japanese surrendered.
The Americans had warned, pleaded, begged, threatened, and done everything in their power to end the war with a civilized surrender. The Japs wouldn't give up, in spite of the Allies virtually destroying their major cities, minor cities, navy, air force, manufacturing capability, capturing their outposts, and making every possible conventional war move. It was necessary to do what was done. The Japanese would have fought to their last man, killing every prisoner they held along the way, and obliterating their nation from the face of the earth, probably thinking that in the after-life, they would receive just rewards for fighting the 'white devils.' Truman did what he had to do, and saved the most lives in the process.
The dropping of those two nuclear bombs on Japan, save at least a million lives, and shortened the war by many months. Those that choose not to recognize that America tried over and over again to get them to surrender, without success, ignore the figures as borne out by history. The death rate in the Jap POW camps was 27%, and in German ones, 4%, The Holocaust did not take place in POW camps. The Germans obeyed the Geneva Convention as best they could, and the Japs didn't even try. The Jap POW camps were so lethal, that few returning veterans would even speak of them, and most of the WW II stories and film, ignore the Jap camps, they were so brutal and death dealing. I can see no wrong in remembering and approving the final act which ended that hideous war. The true crime, was FDR getting us into it in the first place. I still will not own anything Japanese, and am glad to admit it.
Are you really that obtuse?
Yes, of frikkin course. killing people is against the Law, both man's and GOD's.
You cannot begin to understand what happened if you can't understand a place beyond Law.
A place called SURVIVAL.
A place called TOTAL WAR.
Ya think?
Dittos in a few weeks. Gonna be cool!
Actually it's not always. "Thou shalt not Kill" is a poor translation, a better one would have been "Thou shalt not Murder". Many kinds of homicide, such as killing in self defense or killing enemy soldiers during a war, are not murder.
Tell me would you have dropped the Bomb on Berlin to end the the Holocaust ? The Japanese went on a rampage in WWII and did things that we would have hanged the Germans over a dozen times for
I have some sympathy for the individual citizens,but countries that embark on wars of conquest and genocide should be ready for the consequences
Honorable soldiers don't target civilians. George Washington didn't target civilians. Robert E. Lee didn't target civilians.
back then wars were fought by professional armies,and they weren't fighting against Hitler and Co either
You didn't try it yet, did you. Your cowardice speaks for itself.
Those who were attacked by the Japanese lived through something we never had to live through. They have emotions we don't have.
There's no excuse for being racist.
Period.
Strong people are able to laugh at themselves.
Others whine a lot.
:-) You're strong AND wise.
Your arrogance is eclipsed only by your ignorance.
"Exclamation Mark" to trump your "Period."
See #134.
All that is quite different from indiscriminate city = target bombing. To deliberately and indiscriminately kill noncombatants is not, properly speaking, an act of war. It is massacre. It is murder.
I know my professors would freak if I used the term "Jap" in a serious article. It is considered a racial slur.
You are wrong -- dead wrong. You and your professors have never lived through a total war, as WW-II was, where the very existence of the the US as a nation and the lives and liberties of all the world's people were at at stake. I grew up listening to the stories of both veterans and civilians who did.
The Allied forces and their civilian support (which included damn near every man, woman, and child in the Allied countries) had to be unified in the effort to win on every front. The hearts, minds, and souls of everyone had to be 100% committed to the war effort, and a great part of that commitment was recognizing the the enemy as the enemy, and not as a distant cousin with whom one is having a temporary tiff. Japanese enemy were called "Japs" during the war; German enemy were called "Krauts". There were probably some other more or less flattering terms used, but the point is that the enemy is unambiguously differentiated from "us" and our "Allies". Many of those who lived through those years continued to use terminology from the war years. It was more a case of History, than one of racism.
Some PC pantie-waists existed around those times, but were roundly ridiculed into oblivion, shamed into silence, or occasionally locked up or worse for their treasonous actions.
You may very well experience such a "total war" before you get much older. You, and many, many others, will be changed significantly, forever, win or lose.
I can appreciate your point of view. I just get infuriatingly stubborn sometimes. (Surprised?) ;o)
Best wishes.
Thank you very much. You help make communicating unjoyable here when one receives a nice compliment like that.
THX!
I think you and I are pretty much on the same page on this. My guess is the Japanese (in the lump) are every bit as ethnocentric now as they were during WWII. I don't think you can turn away from eons of programming in just a generation or two. I also think that in combatant relations, the Japanese in WWII were about as evil as you can get.
I can say after years of sea stories that there is al least one American that hated the Japanese as much as they hated him. I simply don't think it would cause him to torture a Japanese soldier for fun.
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