Terry Schiavo Report of Autopsy, Full Text as Released by Medical Examiner

Pinellas County Medical Examiner's Office via St. Petersburg Times ^ | June 13, 2005 | Jon R. Thogmartin, MD

[lugsoul]

So, you do think that not providing life-sustaining medical care is 'killing.'

Is there any point at which is it okay to cease care?

[FairOpinion]

Actually one of the doctors the parent brought in was the only one who made the point, that she is blind in one eye, and can only see things very near her with the other.

[FairOpinion]

"Or it proves you need to do a bit more research. "

Look in the mirror and say that to yourself, then DO it.

You made so many incorrect statements -- some of which we corrected -- that demonstrates you just regurgitate the MSM statements and haven't bother to read anything for yourself.

[Auntie Mame]

I concur with every word you write here.

[MarMema]

I would like to hear how it is possible to diagnose someone as PVS without taking into consideration the fact that they are blind.

An excellent point. A study done in England found that many so-called PVS patients were misdiagnosed because of limitations such as blindness.

And it is truly amusing that it wasn't until the autopsy that they were able to pronounce this.

[MarMema]

She had no cerebal cortex, and was not concious, aware.

Generally, after Karen Quinlan, the idea that the cerebral cortex is the center of awareness has been rejected. Instead it is now thought that the hypothalamus serves this function.

[MarMema]

We should remember that when Karen Quinlan died, her autopsy showed that most of her cerebral mantle was intact.

[commonerX]

We Death trolls won, you lost, get over it.

It's all been a conspirancy to destroy humanity.

You are a freaking nut case.

[MarMema]

Quinlan lived for 9 years after her ventilator was disconnected. Bioethicists needed another a solution for disabled people. In 1983, Daniel Callahan noted that "a denial of nutrition may...become the only effective way to make certain that a large number of biologically tenacious people actually die"

"Terri Schiavo is a trial run for the future imploding of Social Security and Medicare. The coming rationing of services was the reason I went to court in 1992 against the prohibition of the private contract. Though it is difficult financially for many to bow out of the system, it may be necessary to do so in the near future to maintain our honor and our values. The shades of the Hegelian Rational Utility are upon us, just as I predicted in my speeches years ago. The rush to judgment despite so many ambiguities was fueled by euthanasia advocates' thirst for a precedent."

the new face of medicaid
"Seniors and the disabled are pushing the program to the breaking point"

[MarMema]

We have therefore two cases with similar presentation (anoxic brain damage) and with similar clinical features (persistent vegetative state). Although pathological examination in both cases confirmed severe anoxic damage, there are significant differences not only in the degree of damage but also in the main site of damage. Although our understanding of cerebral function is quite extensive, with mapping at the functional level of the motor and sensory cortex and a fairly sophisticated understanding of some of the processing that occurs in both the retina and visual cortex, there are also vast areas of the brain (the so called silent areas) where we have very little understanding of their function. The experience of neurosurgeons regularly reveals how, in some cases of trauma and tumours, large areas of the brain can be removed and yet there is good post operative functional recovery. Conversely slight damage to other small areas of the brain can have devastating clinical effects.

"The authors of the article describing Karen Quinlan's pathological findings draw attention to the limitations of our understanding of the neuroanatomical basis for human consciousness. At one time consciousness was though to reside in the cortex, then came our understanding of the limbic system and the role of the brain stem reticular formation in cerebral arousal. The findings in Karen Quinlan's brain suggested that the thalamus played a more crucial role in consciousness and awareness than was previously thought."

[deport]

So the weight of her brain doesn't mean much.

---

What about her entire body wieght..... was it down percentage wise due to loss of fluids?

[MarMema]

We Death trolls won, you lost, get over it.

How lovely. And revealing.

[deport]

and spreading unsubstantiated rumors is not.

---

Conservatives don't participate in 'rumor mongering' now do they?....... That wouldn't be up to their standards would it?...

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

"We Death trolls won, you lost, get over it. It's all been a conspirancy to destroy humanity. You are a freaking nut case."

Yeah, I'm downright crazy to not believe that a Blind judge can read the body languages of witnesses he decided not to allow in the court. I'm a nutcase to hear a human voice on a tape, told by multiple people it was her voice, and then actually believe my lying ears. I'm a nutcase to not believe Judge Greer and ignore all the nurses he so wisely estimated as being 'uncreditable' when he couldn't even see their faces, their stance, their eyes, or the set of their shoulders. I'm a nutcase when Michael's claim of her will is under question, not only based on a deposition, but also based on the long time delay of his claim.

"It's all been a conspirancy to destroy humanity." Yeah, throw it on more thick, why don't you? I didn't mention the slaughter of 6 billion, just 40 million. I realise that 40 million isn't much when you are thinking globally, but that's a pretty big number to me.

I guess I was lied to when I was told that 40 million unborn being slaughtered. I call that a Holocaust. I cannot respect or trust a court system that permitted such a Holocaust. HOW CAN YOU TRUST SUCH A COURT SYSTEM?

They need to be impeached. All those judges who supported that disgraceful mock trial are not fit to hold a gavel. I will not give up on that call. And YOU might as well get over THAT!

[commonerX]

Isn't that what you believe?

[kozachka]

Pages 13-17 have discussion of the examination of brain and neurological examination. I hope some medical doctors here will read it. They talk about some parts of the brain and nerves being normal, and that her optical nerve was thin, but still within the normal range.

The neuropathological report shows several important findings:

1. There was severe hydrocephalus within the cerebral cortex. (The cerebral cortex is the part of the brain which performs higher, non-reflexive functions--i.e. thinking and seeing, rather than breathing or involuntary movement.) The normal volume of CSF (cerbrospinal fluid) in the brain is 125 cc; in Schiavo's case, it was 645 cc (weighing 678 gm).

Schiavo is noted as having pronounced "hydrocephalus ex-vacuo", which occurs when there is damage to the brain, and results in actual shrinkage (atrophy or wasting) of brain tissue.

The brain itself weighed only 615 gm, which means the cranial cavity was more than 50% water (when you consider than brain tissue is denser than CSF).

2. Although the cranial nerves, including the optic nerve, were largely intact, the occipital lobes were the worst affected parts of the brain. The occipital lobes are responsible for visual perception (our mind's interpreting and processing impulses received from the retina). So, while the eyes may have been moving around, Schiavo couldn't actually "see" anything. She was blind.

3. The final comment made by the pathologist: "Brain weight is an important index of its pathologic state. Brain weight is correlated with height, weight, age and sex. The decedent's brain was grossly abnormal and weighed only 615 gm (1.35 pounds). That weight is less than half the expected tabular weight for a decedent of her age, 41 years 3 months 28 days. By way of comparison, the brain of Karen Ann Quinlan weighed 835 grams at the time of her death, after ten years in a similar persistent vegetative state!"

[bjs1779]

Acute hypernatremia often results in significant brain shrinkage, thus causing mechanical traction of cerebral vasculature.

That process doesn't sound like it would be pain free either. Torture would be more apt. No morphine in her system according to M.E.

"brain cell shrinkage causes the brain to pull away from the calvarium => tearing of bridging subdural vessels => intracranial hemorrhage"

hypernatremic+dehydration+occurs,+the+brain+shrinks&hl=en

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

I'm just a layman on the human body, I readilly admit. But if you love someone, and you are told by that loved one's family memebers that she talked, and they play the tape, and they show you videos of her appearing to respond, what would you expect the judge to do? Would you honestly expect the judge to ignore all that?

Frankly, I don't even need to prove that she could have recovered. The burden of proof lies on the executioner.

[lugsoul]

You saw or heard a tape of her talking? Is that the same one Tom DeLay saw?

[commonerX]

Man you are warped, you are encompassing everything from 40 million abortions to Terry.

You have a lot of anger. Maybe you need a vacation or something