Posted on 04/05/2005 10:01:52 PM PDT by Coleus
For the last quarter of a century, this non-Catholic has had a pope. Now that John Paul II is gone, I am even more of an orphan than the Christians in the Roman church. For they will surely have another pope, but that one may not be mine, since I haven't converted.
I am sure I am reflecting the views of many Protestants. Who else but John Paul II gave voice to my faith and my values in 130 countries? Who else posited personal holiness and theological clarity against postmodern self-deception and egotism? Who else preached the gospel as tirelessly as this man?
What other clergyman played any comparable role in bringing down communism, a godless system? What other world leader—spiritual or secular—understood so profoundly how hollow and bankrupt the Soviet empire was, so much so that this tireless writer never bothered to pen an encyclical against Marxism-Leninism because he knew it was moribund?
Has there been a more powerful defender of the sanctity of life than this Pole, in whose pontificate nearly 40 million unborn babies wound up in trashcans and furnaces in the United States alone? What more fitting insight than John Paul II's definition of our culture as a culture of death—an insight that is now clearly sinking in, to wit the declining abortion rates in the United States?
In Europe some time ago, a debate occurred in Protestant churches: Should John Paul II be considered the world's spokesman for all of Christianity? This was an absurd question. Of course he spoke for all believers. Who else had such global appeal and credibility, even to non-Christians and non-believers?
Of course, there was the inveterate Billy Graham. There were many faithful Orthodox and Protestant bishops, pastors and evangelists.
(Excerpt) Read more at christianitytoday.com ...
Oh, so now you want to argue that the Iraq war was a wrong move, eh?
No, please pay attention to my words. I was asking you why you thought it was a just war, what the criteria are, and who is ultimately responsible for making that decision. I'm sorry I was unclear.
Can you answer without jumping all over me for what I did not say?
SD
Would you prefer the pope had called a crusade on Jews, Hindus, and Muslins?
Well there was a time when the Catholic church contended for the faith
My preference would have been that the gospel of Christ be preached rather than the Rodney king version
Great article.
Reading all the hostile exchanges here is most depressing. They miss the point of the article entirely.
While too many Prostestants and Catholics are re-fighting the Reformation, the wolves of Islam are surrounding all Christians and threatening us equally with destruction or forced conversion. To the Wahhabists, differences between Catholics and Protestants are not even academic - they are totally irrelevant.
I supported Bush fully in his actions on the Iraq war. I don't really want to go on an on about the inspections, Saddam's support of terror, the Mid-East power structure, the repression in Iraq,etc.
I am fully in support of Bush. And millions of people in the Middle East and Afganistan are as well.
Thank you. I noticed that the local Methodist Church has a sign out front saying: "Thank You John Paul II". I thought that was pretty nice.
LOL. You are the one who brought up the subject. You specifically stated that it was a "just war." Now it seems you don't even have the foggiest idea about what is meant by that term.
Catholics speak and speak often, but don't say much.
As I said once before, we use terms that have meanings. It may seem to the outsider that we speak to no effect, but that is simply a matter of not understanding what it is you read.
I know I would never fault the Pope for his personal decision about the justness of a given war and personally have no clue about what criteria are used to make that decision.
(And just for the record, there is no direct evidence that the Pope specifically made such a recogning on this war, just that he viewed all war as a failure of humanity.)
SD
SD
Wycliffe - Still excommunicated!
Huss - Still excommunicated!
Tyndale - Still under anathema!
Somehow I do not think it bothers them.
I always chuckle at this. It would take apostolic authority to make a doctrinal declaration of Sola Fide or Sola Scriptura, something none of the Protestant reformers had.
As someone who is neither Protestant nor Catholic, it's pretty obvious the whole Protestant authority argument is incredibly weak, if not totally non-existent.
Having said that, I respect the right of Protestants to believe as they choose.
Yes, I did...in the context of a conversations with someone else. I believe not having participated you did not understand the context.
The context was that somehow because the Pope was not American or not Republican he should not back the Iraq war. Hogwash. Many non-Americans backed the Iraq war, thank God. Whether you want to call a war just (my word at that time), right, good, timely, whatever word you want to use...wars need to be fought to protect the innocent.
The Crusades were fought and many rightly so IMO. We are allowed to have opinions on whether we consider a war "just" aren't we? However, I really don't want to digress and debate war vs. pacifism.
the Rosary, as a physical object, is a sacred object, the presence of which in your home or pocket is, in a certain sense, a constant prayer offered to God, through Mary.
When we pray the Rosary, we start with the cross, say a prayer, then move on to the first bead and say a prayer, then move to the second bead and say a prayer, and continue in this manner until all of the beads are covered. (Whether we go from left to right, or from right to left probably makes no difference.) (Note: You will find all of the prayers at the end of this article.)
The basic configuration of the prayer is simple: the Rosary consists of a Cross, a medal, individual beads, and consecutive beads. For the cross, we pray the Apostles' Creed; for the individual beads, the Our Father, and for the consecutive beads, the Hail Mary. After all of the beads have been covered, it is customary to say some concluding prayers (see below), including petitions (if the petitions have not already been stated), which can be understood to correspond to the medal. (Otherwise, the medal has no corresponding prayers.)
The Rosary can be divided into three parts: the introduction, the five decades, and the conclusion. The introduction consists of the cross and the four beads following it, which together mean the Apostles' Creed, one Our Father, and three Hail Marys. The five decades each consist of one individual bead and ten consecutive beads -- that is of one Our Father, and ten Hail Marys. The concluding prayers can be any Marian prayer, related prayers, and the petitions for which the Rosary is prayed (if the petitions have not already been stated). (See the end of the article for some sample concluding prayers.)
Each decade is devoted to a particular event in the life of Jesus or of the Virgin Mary. For the purposes of the Rosary, these are called mysteries. The focus is always on Jesus. But since the Virgin Mary, as the Mother of Jesus, had (and continues to have) a special relationship with Christ, the Rosary is designed to help us contemplate Christ and His love for humanity through His Mother -- and Our Mother -- on whom He has lavished so much love.
Since the Rosary has five decades, each of which corresponds to one mystery, there are five mysteries for each Rosary. Finally, there are three sets of five mysteries: 1) the Joyful Mysteries, 2) the Sorrowful Mysteries, and 3) the Glorious Mysteries.
The mysteries are the following:
(The custom is to pray each set of mysteries on the days of the week indicated -- but that is just a custom.)
The Joyful Mysteries:
(Monday and Thursday; and the Sundays from 1st Sunday of Advent until Lent.)
1. The Annunciation to Mary
2. The Visitation of Mary
3. The Birth of our Lord Jesus Christ
4. The Presentation of the Child Jesus in the Temple
5. The Finding of Our Lord in the Temple
The Sorrowful Mysteries:
(Tuesday and Friday; and the Sundays of Lent.)
1. The Agony of Christ in the Garden
2. The Scourging at the Pillar
3. The Crowning with Thorns
4. The Carrying of the Cross
5. The Crucifixion and Death of Our Lord on the Cross
Glorious Mysteries:
(Wednesday and Saturday; and the Sundays from Easter until Advent.)
1. The Resurrection of Our Lord
2. The Ascension of Our Lord
3. The Descent of the Holy Spirit upon the Apostles
4. The Assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary into Heaven
5. The Coronation of Our Lady as Queen of Heaven and Earth
When we pray the Joyful Mysteries, the first decade corresponds to the Annunciation, the second decade to the Visitation, the third, to the Birth of Our Lord, the fourth, to the Presentation at the Temple, and the fifth, to the Finding in the Temple.
When we pray the Sorrowful Mysteries, the first decade corresponds to the Agony of Christ in the Garden, the second, to Scourging of Christ, the third, to the Crowning with Thorns, the fourth, to the Carrying of the Cross, and the fifth, to the Crucifixion and Death of Our Lord.
When we pray the Glorious Mysteries, the first decade corresponds to the Resurrection of Our Lord, the second, to the Ascension of Our Lord, the third, to the Descent of the Holy Spirit upon the Apostles, the fourth, to the Assumption of the Virgin Mary, and the fifth, to the Coronation of the Virgin Mary.
Putting It All Together
Now we can look at how all of this is put together. Two different basic approaches have developed, both of which will be covered. Both approaches are equally acceptable, but specific indulgences for the Rosary may require that we follow the local custom.
The First Method
The Introduction:
-- kiss the cross, and make the sign of the cross
-- at the cross -- say the Apostles' Creed
-- at the first individual bead -- say one Our Father
-- at each of the three consecutive beads -- say one Hail Mary
The First Mystery:
-- state the First Mystery
-- optional: state the prayer intention for this mystery
-- at the individual bead -- say one Our Father
-- at each of the ten consecutive beads -- say one Hail Mary
-- after the 10th, say Glory Be and O My Jesus
The Second Mystery:
-- state the Second Mystery,
-- optional: state the prayer intention for this mystery
-- at the individual bead -- say one Our Father
-- at each of the ten consecutive beads -- say one Hail Mary
-- after the 10th, say Glory Be and O My Jesus
The Third Mystery:
-- state the Third Mystery
-- optional: state the prayer intention for this mystery
-- at the individual bead -- say one Our Father
-- at each of the ten consecutive beads -- say one Hail Mary
-- after the 10th, say Glory Be and O My Jesus
The Fourth Mystery:
-- state the Fourth Mystery
-- optional: state the prayer intention for this mystery
-- at the individual bead -- say one Our Father
-- at each of the ten consecutive beads -- say one Hail Mary
-- after the 10th, say Glory Be and O My Jesus
The Fifth Mystery:
-- state the Fifth Mystery
-- optional: state the prayer intention for this mystery
-- at the individual bead -- say one Our Father
-- at each of the ten consecutive beads -- say one Hail Mary
-- after the 10th, say Glory Be and O My Jesus
Conclusion:
-- a Marian prayer
-- if desired, a general prayer, such as a prayer to the Holy Spirit
-- statement of intentions, if not made earlier (the intentions could also be stated at the very beginning)
Note: The usual concluding prayer in the United States appears to be the Hail, Holy Queen, but other prayers, like the Mamorare of St. Bernard, are just as suitable. (See the end of the article for sample prayers.)
-- finally, make the sign of the cross, and the kiss the cross on the Rosary
Catholics believe in continuing apostolic authority in an unbroken line from Jesus Christ.
Protestants deny the need for continuing apostolic authority, claiming the Bible (after removing some books they didn't like) is the ultimate source of authority.
Thank you for your gracious compliment to the pope.
Our governor (not a Catholic) asked for flags to be flown at half-staff for the Pope. Oklahoma is not very Catholic in numbers (like 4-5%), so I thought it was a wonderful gesture on his behalf.
Luther didn't have a problem with indulgences. He had a problem with the corruption of the doctrine.
Luther only came to his realization on sola fide, sola scriptura, etc. when he decided he wanted to start his own church, realized he had no authority, and so created some doctrines that would let him claim authority.
I am neither Catholic nor Protestant.
Just show us the relevant passage from the Catechism. Until you do, Catholics won't take you seriously.
Thank you for your tireless apologetics. You both have far more patience than I.
Suffice it to say that I don't know why you don't have a rosary dedicated to praying to Christ rather than Mary. After all, He's the one who made the sacrifice. She is always so dominant. Real weird.
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